Another (slightly different) grip thread

[papaslides]

I thought about posting this on Paul T's thread, but I didn't want to get in the way of people making suggestions to solve his issue, as I think it's slightly different than mine... anyhow here goes.

I play on a pretty heavily modified King 3B/F (had the whole backend rebuilt with custom tuning slides: an Earl Williams J style main tuning slide, and an open wrap for the f attachment) which solved some serious intonation issues with the horn... except that it made the horn much more front heavy. I recently switched to a carbon fiber slide which has solved that problem perfectly (the front/back balance is superb) but now the left/right balance is off. The horn wants to roll away from me.

I have tried experimenting with Doug Yeo's alternative grip (putting the slide brace between ring/middle fingers) which is... better, but not great. I still have a lot of tension in my shoulder, and because of the shape of the paddle on old Kings I lose most of my dexterity with the trigger.

I primarily play in funk/salsa bands, and also conduct my own band, so I can't rely on any kind of system that makes it more difficult to pick up or put down the horn... does anyone have any ideas on how to tackle this problem? Seems like most of the grips mentioned in Paul T's thread either wouldn't work for a smaller horn like mine, or would add too much complication to picking up and putting down my horn frequently.

Thanks for any suggestions

[timothy42b]

I think side to side balance is the primary cause of tension and hand pain, followed by front to back, followed by the weight. For a very heavy horn the weight might be #2.

I think any grip aid is going to add some complication. You may just have to figure out what you can live with. I saw Jen using an ergobone during the ATW performance this weekend, and it looked pretty quick to get on and off. I don't know how much these resist side to side, I've not seen one up close. Ken's cantilever is very good for weight (cancels it completely) and side to side (if you get it set just right.) It doesn't do much for front to back but you said that's not a problem. It is a bit clunky getting it on and off, but that might be because I haven't played with it enough to work out the process. Is Ken around on this forum? Might get some input from him. Naj... on the old forum.

[BflatBass]

I just added a Neotech to my Conn 88HO so I thought I'd add my 2 bits from what I've learned so far.

The Neotech adds a great deal of comfort because it really spreads out the load on your hand. I don't really have the side to side weight issues but I would think the Neotech would help a great deal because you just don't have to use your hand muscles to hold the horn any more. You'll still be using your wrist, just not your hand (palm) muscles.

It is a bulky grip though. It moved my hand down and away from the slide brace and thumb paddle which forced me to change my slide to bell section angle and since the thumb paddle was too far away I was able to adjust it to solve this but on a lot of horns you won't be able to. If you have small hands I would think this would be an issue.

Finally, getting your left hand in and out (on and off) the horn isn't as quick as without the Neotech. I now make mute changes during a performance with my right hand. Also you will need to put it on and take it off every time the horn is in and out of the case which is very simple and quick but I wonder how it will hold up after doing this for a few years.

I will probably switch over to a Instrument Innovations Ax Handle eventually as it simply acts like a relocated bell brace. I just need to find out if the horn will fit in the case with it on as the Ax Handle won't come off as easy as the Neotech.

Cheers,
Robert

[hyperbolica]

At ATW last week, I saw more and more people using the Get-A-Grip. For several reasons I think it's the second best option. The best option is one of those solder-on Greenhoe thumb rests. They are small, unobtrusive, solid, comfortable, etc. BUT... they also might effect how your horn fits in the case, and they have to be soldered on, and if you don't get it right, you can't just move it yourself. I've tried some of the clamp-on rests like the Curtis, Bullet Brace, and those are just a little clunkier than the elegance of the Greenhoe type.

Get-A-Grip is removable, so your horn still fits in the case, and you can use it on more than one horn. It is adjustable so it works on a lot of horns (but not all), and it's padded leather, so it's comfortable. On the downside, adjustment takes some strength and some tools, and there are some horns it may not fit onto without modification.

I also own a Neotech, and it's much less positive in the solidity of the grip. I found the adjustment difficult and time consuming. Plus, once that piece is on your slide, it might not fit into the case. And it moves your hand away from the slide, so the grip requires a lot of readjustment.

I also own an Ergobone. I keep meaning to 3D print an additional Y-shaped yoke for it so that it doesn't have to be attached to the horn, the horn can just rest in the yoke. I don't use my ergobone, but I'm always thinking about how it's almost a really cool thing, but not quite.