Yamaha YBL-835D - Review after 1st month and 1st concert

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sirisobhakya
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Yamaha YBL-835D - Review after 1st month and 1st concert

Post by sirisobhakya »

TL;DR - Pro: big sound, easy blow especially in double valve, ergonomics. Con: harder to control (than 830), screw bell (!), no case.

After traveling to Japan in April 2024 to try so many bass trombones to the point that some shops in Japan might want to ban me from visiting (described here viewtopic.php?p=239869#p239869), and later, after selling many horns (my previous 830, Wessex German Kaiserbariton, and Chinese rotary bass trumpet), I got my new horn at last: a Yamaha YBL-835D from Yamaha Ginza.

Against the well-established precaution that Yamaha Xeno horns are wildly inconsistent, I bought this horn sight unseen. I didn’t plan to do this at first; my plan was to go to various shops in Tokyo and try as many as I can. But when I asked, most shops that had the 835D already sold them, and a shop (DAC Shinjuku, where I first tried a YBL-835D and originally plan to purchase the horn) even told me the next scheduled delivery is in January 2025. Already bought the ticket at that time because I am stupid... sorry because so many Thais traveled to Japan on new year holiday (the planes I was on was full to the last seat both flights, and I encountered Thais everywhere!). The ticket also cannot be refunded nor changed due to being low-cost carrier ticket, obviously I panicked that I wouldn't be able to buy the horn on the trip. So I decided to reserve the first horn that was in stock at any shop. Asking many Yamaha shops as far as Hamamatsu (2 hours Shinkansen ride from Tokyo) and even Miki Gakki in Osaka, I was lucky that Ginza shop has one in stock so I placed the order right away. I was relieved that the horn turns out to be one of the best I have ever played.

(After that, both DAC and Wind Crew received additional 835D, but the one at DAC was already sold out at the time I was there.)

After almost 1 month, 1 casual audition, and 1 concert done with the horn, here is my review.

Pros

Sound
After I got the horn, I tested it back-to-back with 12 horns (2 Bach 50B3Os, 2 Throjas, 2 Edwards B502s, 2 Courtois, a Willson, a Shires Q, a K&H, and a 835G one-piece gold-brass-bell version), and the 835D beats almost all of them, at least for my preference anyway. Granted, I have bias, but listen to the recordings using both iPhone and a good microphone confirms this. The sound has somewhat more low-mid frequency than other horns that makes it sound thick and large, while still having the brilliance. The two Bach 50s has more very low end frequency, which I can understand why so many people love Bach, but there is something in the sound of all the Bachs I have tried that I don't quite like. The ones that beats it (by a small margin) are the Throjas, but they have their own ergonomics problem (slide spring) and cost almost 4 times more. The Willson and the Shires Q come close.

Blow
Comparing to my previous 830, the low C and B are much more free-blowing and articulate, and I can play much more relaxed in the lower and lowest registers. However, I have some control problems in the middle registers, described below in cons section.

Ergonomics
As I said in the play-test thread, Yamaha horns seems to be built with Asian hand size in mind, and it is more comfortable to hold than most European and American horns. The new Gb paddle and the hand rest needs some adkjustment for me, but after adjusting they are comfortable, but admittedly I don't use the handrest that much due to the fear that it would bend the brace.


Cons

Stability and Control
Maybe the result of the lessened resistance, or maybe because I am still not adjusted to it (I sold the 830 in September, then used a Bach 50B that is very front-heavy as interim horn before getting the 835D, and due to different in playing angle my embouchure might have changed a bit), I feel that the horn is harder to control and focus than my previous 830, which is very tight and compact. I also get splitting tone sometimes when my lips are dry (unfortunately that was during a concert last Sunday). With the 830 the spliting occured around middle Gb and G, and was easier to rectify. With the 835D the splitting, when occurs, occurs all the way from G to tuning Bb. The 3rd partial ( :bassclef: :line4: to :bassclef: :line2: ) also needs somewhat tighter control of breath and embouchure than the 830.

Screw Bell
This maybe a pro for many people, but a con for me. Having an additional point of failure on one of the weakest part of the horn is a bit nerve-wrecking. It increases assembly and disassembly time of the horn. And normally I rest the horn on the bell on my lap, but with the screw bell I don't feel comfortable with that practice anymore, so a trombone stand is a necessity. But the sound from screw bell version is much better with more core and presence, so I have no choice but to learn to live with it...

No Case from Yamaha
The most annoying consequence from the screw bell is that Yamaha doesn't supply any case. I bought a Marcus Bonna cut bell case, which is both good-looking and sturdy enough (it was loaded as checked baggage because the airline didn't allow it to as carry-on baggage), but I miss the Yamaha case. Also the Bonna case costed me $600.

This is a (not so) short comparison video between almost all the horns I have tried against the YBL-835D. Mouthpiece used is Yamaha Douglas Yeo. The piece is Khmer Saiyok, traditional Thai song. iPhone 16 microphone.



Summary - large sound, free-blowing, and good ergonomics, but harder to control, screw bell is quite a hassle for me, and no provided case.

Would I recommend it? Yes. Please have a try if you can. At around 4,500 USD (before any tax, current exchange rate) I think it is a good value for money for any level of bass trombonist.
Chaichan Wiriyaswat
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Re: Yamaha YBL-835D - Review after 1st month and 1st concert

Post by Finetales »

That's a shame that Yamaha doesn't include a case with the 835D. I bet they would make a really great (and very compact) screw bell case.
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Re: Yamaha YBL-835D - Review after 1st month and 1st concert

Post by Burgerbob »

I'd feel free to rest the horn on your leg. A screwbell is probably stronger than a normal bell. It's only the threads you need to worry about slightly more than usual.
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Re: Yamaha YBL-835D - Review after 1st month and 1st concert

Post by RJMason »

I just finished two years traveling the world with an 891ZD running around stage navigating all types of situations whacking the horn against road cases and everything that would’ve destroyed a hastily assembled modern American trombone with soft metal parts. The lacquer is in great shape and the bell never suffered any damage. Yamaha builds em better.
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Re: Yamaha YBL-835D - Review after 1st month and 1st concert

Post by Tbarh »

Yamaha horns "wildly inconsistent"?? When did that happen ?
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Re: Yamaha YBL-835D - Review after 1st month and 1st concert

Post by sirisobhakya »

Tbarh wrote: Sun Jan 26, 2025 4:31 am Yamaha horns "wildly inconsistent"?? When did that happen ?
Xenos are. Many people here have said that. I have also experieced this first hand: the 4 830s I have tried are all over the map. The one that was mine leans a bit to the bright side, and the resistance is moderate. My friend's is more free-blowing but lacks focus and sounds a bit dull. Another one, owned by a professor (in bio-science) and purchased in the USA, is darker but less free-blowing. The last one is just bland and meh.

I think the percentage of handmaking is higher in the Xeno range, and that resulted in the aforementioned inconsistency.

However, the 3 835Ds I have tried are almost identical. The one I tried at DAC Shin-Okubo and my current horn are almost identical, which is fortunate since the one at DAC is the reason I decided to buy the 835D in the first place. The one I tried at Miki Gakki Osaka is a bit brighter.
Chaichan Wiriyaswat
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Re: Yamaha YBL-835D - Review after 1st month and 1st concert

Post by Burgerbob »

Tbarh wrote: Sun Jan 26, 2025 4:31 am Yamaha horns "wildly inconsistent"?? When did that happen ?
With the introduction of the hand hammered bells, I think
Aidan Ritchie, LA area player and teacher
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Re: Yamaha YBL-835D - Review after 1st month and 1st concert

Post by Tbarh »

Burgerbob wrote: Sun Jan 26, 2025 8:39 am
Tbarh wrote: Sun Jan 26, 2025 4:31 am Yamaha horns "wildly inconsistent"?? When did that happen ?
With the introduction of the hand hammered bells, I think
Given that I am no big fan of Yamaha trombones(too tight and "monochromatic" sounding for my taste) I have not played too many of them lately ,so that's the reason I am asking ...Because ; I have always thought that the big sales pitch of Yamaha bones was the consistency! Also the hand hammered bell ones.. Yamaha has been hand hammering bells a long time before the introduction of the Xeno models, and I have always found them to be very consistent and true to their sound philosophy.. However; the nature of hand hammering bells means that the results will differ according to change of bell makers wich will inevitably happen over time..Good to know :good:
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Re: Yamaha YBL-835D - Review after 1st month and 1st concert

Post by Burgerbob »

It's something they do to the modern horns, they are very soft. Whatever it is makes them highly variable
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Re: Yamaha YBL-835D - Review after 1st month and 1st concert

Post by RJMason »

Played this horn at NAMM. I thought it was very good. I liked it better than the Shires basses and thought it was the best bass there. But I also didn’t think the horn was a game changer (my modified 612 is dependent but has more vibe). The 835D is way more comfy though!

Hand hammered inconsistent, yes possibly. The 891ZD at NAMM was just a better blowing and feeling horn than mine. Not
Talking about sound, too loud to tell, though I waited until things quieted down and no drummers were playing to give it a 10 min test. Mine feels stressed (and I just had it worked on at the Atelier), this one didn’t. Now I want to take mine apart and resolder it lol
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