TromboneChat

Hi folks!

I play a newer Yamaha 620 with 48 mouthpiece
For orchestral work. .547 bore. But I am
Considering a JDM only 456g for my jazz ensemble work. Smaller bore .525 and possibly a 47 mp
I haven’t gotten it yet but after some research, it might be what I need. I hate changing instruments and do not like switching mouthpieces but I don’t like how my 620 sounds on jazz.
I am a high level player just in case I didn’t make it clear.

Any thoughts and impressions ? TIA

Depending on what the rest of the section is playing, the 456 might be good for 3rd. I wouldn't use it for 1st or 2nd unless the rest of the section was using larger instruments.

If you are playing 1st or 2nd I'd suggest something smaller. If you really must have that F-attachment, look for a King 3B-F or Olds Recording with F. I've found that playing 1st or 2nd in a Jazz Band doesn't really require a trigger.

Well in that case I might as well use my 620. I can hit notes easily above high Bb. The sound is just too orchestral for me for jazz. I like the edginess and sharpness of smaller bore. Any good brass musician really does not prefer to change mouthpieces as much as possible. I play trombone 1 in jazz and principal in both orchestras.

I want the ability to fill in bass bone parts as needed. When I’m not playing. So a trigger is necessary for me in jazz. I also like the range it provides in lower register. So even though I can do without a trigger for jazz, I’d prefer it! I wish I could test a bunch of horns at same place but that’s impossible!

Thanks for your input!!

This is all just my opinion, but if you're playing the upper parts in a big band, you should really have something 500 or 508. Bigger than that, you can get a lot of volume, but its too broad to have the characteristic big band sound. If you're playing old tunes, you can get away with a 547 for bass, but newer tunes you might need a double valve bass.

You might get the most coverage out of keeping your 620 for low parts, including use as a semi-bass. And then get a King 3bF (with a trigger) for upper parts. Then you can get a DE XT 102 G8 for your big horn and a XT 102 D3 for the 3bF.

The 456 is a dual bore 500/525. If you're stuck on Yamaha, I'd go 651, 891, 897 for lead or second parts, your 456 for 2/3 and your 620 or a double bass for 4th.

Bass (or 4th bone) charts can be all over the map. I played a big band gig last night where on some charts the 4th was higher than the 3rd part. And then some bass parts require at least 1 valve, and some will require 2 valves. You shouldn't be playing lead on anything you can also play bass on. You can physically do it, but I don't think it gives the right sound.

If you're not playing in a proper big band bone section, then you can get away with a bigger range of horns.

As far as the mouthpiece goes, I'd recommend getting set up with a Doug Elliot piece. You can get the same rim on cup/shank combos that fit your 547 or small bore bones. I used to have a hard time changing mouthpieces too, but now I use DE stuff, and I have the same rim for all horns up to 547. And then a different rim for bass.

A mouthpiece to consider is the Shilke 47B. It is just slightly smaller diameter than your 48 and is shallower for Jazz/lead.

Yes. I already actually ordered the 47B Shilke . Just to clarify I don’t play bass trombone. I only play it to fill in or double up on a few parts here and there only in the jazz ensemble. The jazz ensemble is for fun and music is nearly as demanding. But I enjoy it immensely and was really missing it! We play lots of standards and original big band pieces. It’s a blast.

I mean the jazz ensemble music isn’t as demanding but super fun. As you know, We trombonists have lots of rests in orchestral music!

The thing about most medium bores that makes it a chore to play lead or high parts, IMO, is the larger bell not the bore size per se. Yamaha bells in particular actually have a pretty large throat on their medium bores. A King 607F feels substantially zippier than any Yamaha in my hands, I suspect for that reason. (Although the stock pipe in those 607Fs is also pretty tight too which doesn't hurt for lead playing).

The King 3BF (0.508" bore w/ F-attachment) is the perfect chameleon horn for you.
The right (slightly edgy) sound for big band lead, but the range to also (occasionally) play the 4th trombone parts.

I'm guessing that you'll like the Schilke 47B mouthpiece for lead playing.
But you may want to switch to a larger piece for 4th trombone.
(Or take the Doug Elliott route so you can stay on the same rim inside diameter.)