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Yamaha 645 Counterweights
Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2021 8:11 pm
by afugate
Recently I've had problems with my hands and wrists due to some repetitive strain issues. As I played my Yamaha 645 this evening I really felt like the horn was front heavy. That was something I'd noticed in the past, but it was really evident tonight. So I started experimenting. I wound up taping an old trumpet mouthpiece and about 10 pennies to the torpedo weight. Oh my goodness. That was SOOO much better.
Now I'm considering replacing my torpedo weight with something heavier.
Does anyone know how much the traditional Yamaha disk weight weighs? Ditto for the cool batwing weight?
--Andy in OKC
Re: Yamaha 645 Counterweights
Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2021 11:57 pm
by PaulT
Nothing specific to your query, but I have a Yamaha 640 (.525 trigger) and I added a weight (from a 630 straight) and made a wonderful difference in the horn's balance. It is now (for me) balanced absolutely perfect!
I have another horn that I felt was slightly nose heavy, and adding a counter weight didn't change the feel. But adding a counter weight to the 640 made it perfect!
So, experiment. What works, works.
Re: Yamaha 645 Counterweights
Posted: Sat Jun 19, 2021 7:28 am
by afugate
Someone on the forums suggested a D-size battery for weight comparison. I also saw a post suggesting a plastic bag in which to add coins until one felt good about the weight. I like that idea and will probably experiment with both of these to see how much weight I want.
--Andy in OKC
Re: Yamaha 645 Counterweights
Posted: Sat Jun 19, 2021 9:22 pm
by bassclef
PaulT wrote: ↑Fri Jun 18, 2021 11:57 pm
Nothing specific to your query, but I have a Yamaha 640 (.525 trigger) and I added a weight (from a 630 straight) and made a wonderful difference in the horn's balance. It is now (for me) balanced absolutely perfect!
I have another horn that I felt was slightly nose heavy, and adding a counter weight didn't change the feel. But adding a counter weight to the 640 made it perfect!
So, experiment. What works, works.
Did you have a brace added to the 640 tuning slide, or just slot in the whole tuning slide (w/brace & counterweight) from the 630?
Re: Yamaha 645 Counterweights
Posted: Sat Jun 19, 2021 9:33 pm
by bassclef
afugate wrote: ↑Fri Jun 18, 2021 8:11 pm
Now I'm considering replacing my torpedo weight with something heavier.
Yours could be different, but you might find that when you take the two pieces of the torpedo-shaped part off that the brace doesn't go all the way through. I had an older Yamaha with that counterweight style once, I really can't remember the model, and it was made like that. I do sort of remember some cavities inside of the torpedo-shaped parts though. You could look into having some lead put in those.
Better yet - no heat involved, less permanent and much heavier per cubic inch than lead - there is a tungsten putty product used for adding weight to your fly fishing rig instead of split shot. You could pack those cavities with that stuff.
Here's my brand of choice:
https://www.orvis.com/orvis-soft-tungst ... 20900.html
Re: Yamaha 645 Counterweights
Posted: Sun Jun 20, 2021 5:33 am
by afugate
bassclef wrote: ↑Sat Jun 19, 2021 9:33 pm
afugate wrote: ↑Fri Jun 18, 2021 8:11 pm
Now I'm considering replacing my torpedo weight with something heavier.
Yours could be different, but you might find that when you take the two pieces of the torpedo-shaped part off that the brace doesn't go all the way through. I had an older Yamaha with that counterweight style once, I really can't remember the model, and it was made like that. I do sort of remember some cavities inside of the torpedo-shaped parts though. You could look into having some lead put in those.
Better yet - no heat involved, less permanent and much heavier per cubic inch than lead - there is a tungsten putty product used for adding weight to your fly fishing rig instead of split shot. You could pack those cavities with that stuff.
Here's my brand of choice:
https://www.orvis.com/orvis-soft-tungst ... 20900.html
Thank you. I'll check into this.
--Andy in OKC
Re: Yamaha 645 Counterweights
Posted: Sun Jun 20, 2021 2:05 pm
by PaulT
mistake. deleted
Re: Yamaha 645 Counterweights
Posted: Sun Jun 20, 2021 2:06 pm
by PaulT
bassclef wrote: ↑Sat Jun 19, 2021 9:22 pm
PaulT wrote: ↑Fri Jun 18, 2021 11:57 pm
Nothing specific to your query, but I have a Yamaha 640 (.525 trigger) and I added a weight (from a 630 straight) and made a wonderful difference in the horn's balance. It is now (for me) balanced absolutely perfect!
I have another horn that I felt was slightly nose heavy, and adding a counter weight didn't change the feel. But adding a counter weight to the 640 made it perfect!
So, experiment. What works, works.
Did you have a brace added to the 640 tuning slide, or just slot in the whole tuning slide (w/brace & counterweight) from the 630?
I swapped in the tuning slide (complete with brace and counterweight) from the 630.
For me, the swap improved the balance/playing comfort of the 640 noticeably; the horn plants itself nicely on my shoulder and I just play the slide with no sense of supporting it. Combined with the installation of a NeoTech grip the horn now has "all day" comfort. It didn't before.
(without the NeoTech, I would not play a trigger horn for any reason or purpose. At my pay grade ($0) it just would not be worth it and I wouldn't do it. And I will not give up that weight in back, either. )
Re: Yamaha 645 Counterweights
Posted: Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:36 pm
by afugate
bassclef wrote: ↑Sat Jun 19, 2021 9:33 pm
Yours could be different, but you might find that when you take the two pieces of the torpedo-shaped part off that the brace doesn't go all the way through. I had an older Yamaha with that counterweight style once, I really can't remember the model, and it was made like that. I do sort of remember some cavities inside of the torpedo-shaped parts though. You could look into having some lead put in those.
I removed the weight tonight. You are correct. The brace does not go through the torpedo weight. There are two stubs that extend from the tuning slide and the weight fits between them. Both of the stubs are hollow, so I might be able to fill them with something like the tungsten putty you mentioned. However, I weighed the torpedo weight on our food scale. It weighs 5.5 oz. I suspect I would prefer more weight added than what I would get from filling the two stubs.
I think I will experiment to see just how much weight I actually want. The trumpet mouthpiece I taped on temporarily weights 3.5 oz. A D cell battery weighs about 4.5 oz., so that's where I'll start.
--Andy