TromboneChat

I had my tech install the factory Bach 142 loose pipe collar (mouthpipe receiver) to my stock 42 slide. The inner slide appears too long and sticks out a bit you can see in the photo. Or is that actually the soldered in lead pipe? I cannot even push down the threaded lead pipes all the way to actually screw in. It's so tight. The "Open Long" pipe almost will not fit at sticks out from the receiver about a quarter of an inch.

Did you have the leadpipe removed? Looks like the slide tube to me.

I should have asked specifically. That is kind of the point, right? I knew there was an issue when I left, assuming it was only the longest mouth pipe not fitting correctly so my intention was to contact Bach in the morning. The other two pipes I did not have with me, came home with the slide and insert them. They do not seat, maybe it sticks out a quarter of an inch and don't catch the threads. I don't have the soldered in lead pipe remains so I'm assuming it's still there.. When I look up into the slide it looks pretty bear, like one long tube.

Burgerbob wrote: ↑Wed Feb 26, 2020 9:14 pm Did you have the leadpipe removed? Looks like the slide tube to me.

Do you happen to know if the upper and lower tubes are the same length?

It's definitely the slide tube. It's just sticking up a bit... I think I've had a similar issue with a 50 slide. A real tech can probably answer your question!

Burgerbob wrote: ↑Wed Feb 26, 2020 9:31 pm It's definitely the slide tube. It's just sticking up a bit... I think I've had a similar issue with a 50 slide. A real tech can probably answer your question!

Yep if it get's pushed down it won't align correctly with the lower tube at the base. Also, trimming it was not recommended. I still wonder if that is an option because the pipes are not absolutely not screwing down.

Again, I'm not a tech, but I would say you'll probably have to have the tube trimmed.

Throw it against the wall!

Some leadpipes are really tight. But bearing in mind that the pipes are usually measured in widths of paper, it wouldn't hurt to have someone with a pair of calipers check to make sure you aren't trying to fit 11 pounds of potatoes in a 10 pound sack. That definitely won't work.

Here’s my theory: there’s just some hunk in there. Was the inside of the inner slide really cleaned well? Right after the leadpipe there could have been some buildup and if the Open Long pipe is, say, 1/4” longer than the standard pipe it could get caught on it.

Or it’s just not a perfect fitting pipe. Or your tube is out of round enough to stop it from going in. Or there’s a small dent. Or...

Is the receiver end of the leadpipe too large to fit in the inner slide tube possibly? Or is the fitting on the end of the leadpipe running into the inner slide tube?

I have to wonder how much experience your tech has with trombone slides. That is the inner tube. It needs to be trimmed to fit. Techs trim inner tubes all the time. When in doubt, techs will start with long tubes and cut to order. And why would any tech look at that and think they are done?... The tube looks like it is partially blocking the threads.

You might consider taking it to someone else.

The Bach 42 with a normal non-threaded receiver has the slide tube expanded at the end in order for the leadpipe to fit inside of it. I don't know if that's the case with a threaded receiver, but perhaps the tech failed to expand the end of the slide tube properly. It does look like there is some space around the slide tube. You're obviously going to have to take it back to the shop and have someone figure it out. If you draw a line along the length of the leadpipe with a magic marker, you can insert it to the point that it stops and rotate it a little, then remove it. If it's getting stuck up at the receiver end, the line will be worn off up near the threaded ring, and then you will know if that's the problem.

FullPedalTrombonist wrote: ↑Thu Feb 27, 2020 9:08 pm Here’s my theory: there’s just some hunk in there. Was the inside of the inner slide really cleaned well? Right after the leadpipe there could have been some buildup and if the Open Long pipe is, say, 1/4” longer than the standard pipe it could get caught on it.

Or it’s just not a perfect fitting pipe. Or your tube is out of round enough to stop it from going in. Or there’s a small dent. Or...

Matt K wrote: ↑Thu Feb 27, 2020 8:57 pm Some leadpipes are really tight. But bearing in mind that the pipes are usually measured in widths of paper, it wouldn't hurt to have someone with a pair of calipers check to make sure you aren't trying to fit 11 pounds of potatoes in a 10 pound sack. That definitely won't work.

I have the older Bach-style thumb screw-clamp style lead pipes for my lightweight slide, they actually all pass through the hole, up to the point that it has to be screwed in. There may be less tolerances on the newer threaded type.

There was actually a little more to the original story... The original upper tube had so much solder from the factory, that it broke off while it was being removed so a new upper tube had to be ordered and replaced (at no cost to me). So that is a brand new pipe.

brassmedic wrote: ↑Fri Feb 28, 2020 12:05 am The Bach 42 with a normal non-threaded receiver has the slide tube expanded at the end in order for the leadpipe to fit inside of it. I don't know if that's the case with a threaded receiver, but perhaps the tech failed to expand the end of the slide tube properly. It does look like there is some space around the slide tube. You're obviously going to have to take it back to the shop and have someone figure it out. If you draw a line along the length of the leadpipe with a magic marker, you can insert it to the point that it stops and rotate it a little, then remove it. If it's getting stuck up at the receiver end, the line will be worn off up near the threaded ring, and then you will know if that's the problem.

I don't know if I'd do this project conversion ever again. Especially given it took around 9 months to get the parts to do it. Anyway, once complete, it will have been a year.

I did not really want the threaded type receiver, I thought I needed a new cork barrel to fit the pipes from my other Bach. Then I saw the threads when I got the parts, I said "Oh No" I had a feeling there could be some issues.

greenbean wrote: ↑Thu Feb 27, 2020 9:31 pm I have to wonder how much experience your tech has with trombone slides. That is the inner tube. It needs to be trimmed to fit. Techs trim inner tubes all the time. When in doubt, techs will start with long tubes and cut to order. And why would any tech look at that and think they are done?... The tube looks like it is partially blocking the threads.

You might consider taking it to someone else.

My tech had never tried this type of repair, it wasn't understood cutting would be involved. Unfortunately, I had to source another tech "locally" as in another state away to complete the project. It's in the shop right now, hopefully I will get it back and receive some closure.

Bach42t wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 9:49 am
There was actually a little more to the original story... The original upper tube had so much solder from the factory, that it broke off while it was being removed so a new upper tube had to be ordered and replaced (at no cost to me). So that is a brand new pipe.

No, it wasn't the amount of solder. Since the end of the slide tube is expanded at the factory to accommodate the leadpipe, the tube cannot be removed from the cork barrel without shrinking it back down. If that isn't done, it will never come out, or it will break if you try to force it to come out (which is what happened). My guess is that since the tech put a new slide tube on without expanding the end, that's probably why the leadpipe won't fit.

Brad has hit the nail on the head here.

Also, If it is a new cork barrel assembly the ID of the cork barrel might have to be opened up as well. That way the expanded part at the top of the inner fits both the leadpipe and the cork barrel properly....I hope that makes sense.

MDM

brassmedic wrote: ↑Sat Mar 14, 2020 12:09 am

Bach42t wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 9:49 am
There was actually a little more to the original story... The original upper tube had so much solder from the factory, that it broke off while it was being removed so a new upper tube had to be ordered and replaced (at no cost to me). So that is a brand new pipe.

No, it wasn't the amount of solder. Since the end of the slide tube is expanded at the factory to accommodate the leadpipe, the tube cannot be removed from the cork barrel without shrinking it back down. If that isn't done, it will never come out, or it will break if you try to force it to come out (which is what happened). My guess is that since the tech put a new slide tube on without expanding the end, that's probably why the leadpipe won't fit.