Getting butts in seats for a big band concert

[Cmillar]

@Wilktone: The $800 was for a performance so it included all royalties (since we did not have BMI membership; just ASCAP).

I would bet that pop stuff like Taylor Swift or Beyoncé will have a lot of roadblocks to creating a Big Band arrangement unless done by their respective arrangers for a gig.

The Military Big Bands have "in house" arrangers to provide arrangements of popular music for their use (your tax dollars at work ). It's too bad these arrangements cannot be bought because they are done by the Military and cannot be given because of copyright issues.

Plus, the Military Bands don't charge admission for their concerts and they aren't in the business of trying to make money at a gig or off of their recordings.

Quite different than the 'civilian world'.

[Mikebmiller]

Has anybody played an arrangement of a Taylor Swift song? Shake It Off for big band?

I recall talking to Fred Sturm about some Steely Dan arrangements he did for the WDR Big Band. He couldn’t SELL me copies of the arrangements, he said, but he could
GIVE me copies.

Any chance you could GIVE anyone else those charts?

[Bach5G]

A local new music ensemble performed Zappa’s Yellow Shark (“new”? Must be 50 years old! Over half a century).

Paid through the nose to the Zappa estate, I heard. SRO though.

quote=Mikebmiller post_id=228055 time=1702781599 user_id=213]

Back to Mikebmiller’s original inquiry…

*The “holiday sweater with any type of pants look” is not working for this group.

A friend who started up a big band used to advise: Dress as if you’re getting paid.

[tbdana]

Looking at the big band examples you listed made me wonder a bit as to how accurate your impression is of the material these bands perform. Your take on this seemed as if these bands were largely playing pop or rock charts, sneaking in the occasional swing chart. My impression is the opposite, these bands largely played more straight-ahead jazz, but snuck in funk and rock charts from time to time.

For example, Gordon Goodwin's Big Phat Band's first album was "Swinging For the Fences." There are 10 tracks on it.

• Sing Sang Sung - A tribute or parady of Sing Sing Sing, a popular tune from the swing era. Shuffle groove.
  Count Bubba - Straight ahead swing chart
  Samba Del Gringo - Latin tune
  Bach 2 Part Invention in D Minor - Jazz waltz arrangement of themes by Bach.
  I Remember - Bossa groove.
  Swinging For the Fences - Bebop chart
  Mueva Los Huesos - Another latin chart, salsa groove
  Second Chances - Straight 8ths waltz, on the mellow side with lots of instrumental colors
  There's the Rub - Funk chart, reminds me of Tower of Power
  A Few Good Men - A "rock march" chart.

So out of 10 charts, there are 2 that might be called "commercial" style.

Dave, I don't think anyone is saying that modern big bands don't play a lot of tunes with a swing or bebop feel. That's the bread and butter for most bands. But I'd hardly call that "straight-ahead jazz," especially when applied to Gordon Goodwin's tunes. First, Gordon is an insane person. LOL! I don't think you can call anything he has written "straight ahead." It's swing, yeah, but it has turned left and driven far down the road away from swing band material. I dare say that most of the typical "swing bands" probably couldn't even play Gordon's charts (especially the sax sections, as Gordon writes insane sax solis).

An example from Gordon's early writing comes to mind. He wrote a tune on I Got Rhythm changes, but it was focused on lydian tonality, with lots of tritones in the tonic chords. It was unrecognizable as I Got Rhythm, and in fact was aptly named I Got D'Zzzs.



Yeah, it's "swing." But I don't think anyone can call this "straight ahead" or something that a "swing band" would play. It's very modern (even though it was written almost 40 years ago). And that's the case will most things done by Gordon's Phat band and other modern, concert-oriented big bands. The feel is swing, but it ain't your grandfather's swing!

[Bach5G]

Thread hijack: heck of a photo of Watrous’ embouchure. Any of the TTC embouchure gurus care to comment?

[Wilktone]

Dave, I don't think anyone is saying that modern big bands don't play a lot of tunes with a swing or bebop feel. That's the bread and butter for most bands. But I'd hardly call that "straight-ahead jazz," especially when applied to Gordon Goodwin's tunes.

I don't think it's worth getting into what "straight ahead jazz" is commonly understood to be in this topic. The Bill Watrous track you posted is great, by the way, but I would also think also of it as straight-ahead (Albeit with some "out" features borrowed from free jazz. It's certainly not fusion or avant-garde).

As far as getting an audience out to hear big band performances goes, I did run a big band on my own for about 17 years, so I've had a lot of time to make mistakes and try some different things. Regarding the music I programmed, I listened to what audiences told me after our performance, tried to accommodate a request if I could, and paid attention to the sizes of our audiences for different concert themes.

For that band and this area, I found that audiences are largest for us when we play something like a swing dance or a Christmas concert. Audiences also like to come out to hear music by particular bands, so Benny Goodman or Duke Ellington concert usually does well. I've also put together performances where every chart on the show was written by someone in the band or in the area. There is something of an audience for those performances, but they didn't do as well as the other shows I mentioned above. But I also find that when you play the same original charts a bunch that they become familiar to regular audience members.

Over all the experimentation on programming I came up with a framework for programming music that audiences would enjoy and come back to hear the band again in a month. I would mostly program straight-ahead charts, making sure that there would be at least a couple of recognizable charts from the swing era and that there would be several charts each set that would be danceable. Around those charts I looked for charts that would provide some variety (latin, funk, something in a different meter, something a little "out," etc.). And at least a couple of charts each set to feature a vocalist.

Thread hijack: heck of a photo of Watrous’ embouchure. Any of the TTC embouchure gurus care to comment?

Reinhardt type IIIA. We've talked about his chops a bunch here before. The Lloyd Leno film on my YouTube channel has slow motion video of Watrous playing a Bb above high Bb, slow motion with a transparent mouthpiece.

Dave

[marccromme]

The problem is that the typical audience for Big Bands is becoming a bunch of blue hairs like the audience for classical.

The aging Boomers and Greatest Generation are the only folks who seem to want to listen to Big Bands.

Yes, and there the sales are. You need to find places where elderly people with cultural interests and money in the pockets meet anyhow. Some examples

Coworking with the Danish Club for the Elderly called ældresagen, which has local chapters all over the country, our amateur Big Band sold 250 tickets in a smaller town in 10 days , no more seats available.

We played a dance gig for 300 paying guest at the annunal Veteran Car Association meeting, they loved it and danced after their congress and dinner for 3 hours.

Tivoli Concert Hall in the Tivoli Garden in the Center of Copenhagen , which is very popular among elderly, fits about 1200 seats, we did often sell about 900 seats when playing with the Copenhagen Police Band, a wind orchester, when using popular but aging singers, remembered by the aging listeners.

Filled a circus tent with 600 seats, again with a convention of the Club for the Elderly.

Sold 250 seats at a concert after lunch on a full day convention of Inner Wheels, the ladies fraction of Rotary Club

All these concerts where piggy packed on events where the audience came anyhow.

Just some thoughts for you. ...

[tbdana]

Reinhardt type IIIA. We've talked about his chops a bunch here before. The Lloyd Leno film on my YouTube channel has slow motion video of Watrous playing a Bb above high Bb, slow motion with a transparent mouthpiece.

Dave

That video was quite interesting (and pretty disgusting ). Some of those embouchures really surprised me. Thanks for posting it.

[Cmillar]

The problem is that the typical audience for Big Bands is becoming a bunch of blue hairs like the audience for classical.


The aging Boomers and Greatest Generation are the only folks who seem to want to listen to Big Bands.

Yes, and there the sales are. You need to find places where elderly people with cultural interests and money in the pockets meet anyhow. Some examples

...but, it is encouraging that younger audiences are attending more and more symphony concerts. (here in North America). It's still a tough sell, but statistics show that more younger people are going out to hear the symphony especially when they perform concerts devoted to John Williams or other 'theme concerts'. Then, the symphony can also play some other music as well in the hopes of inspiring a new generation of listeners. A lot of it comes down to clever marketing depending on the type of city and the culture of the city.

And, here in North America, audiences are packed for 'Tribute Bands' (ie: Chicago, Three (One!) Dog Night, ABBA's, Beatles's, etc. etc. etc.)

The audience? Pretty much age 60 and over. They have the time and money to 're-live' their youth.

It's like playing an 'Elvis tribute' concert. You have to wear sunglasses because the light reflects off the sea of silver/gray hair that's out there, plus you also need to arrive early in order to get around the fast-moving walkers and wheel chairs if you want to get to the theatre entrance in time

I play in a really good R&B/Funky Rock band. It's great to have 20-somethings' come up and say they're knocked out by the music. That's an excellent sign.

Anyways..... a gig's a gig. (but these are fun, challenging, and enjoyable to all....band members and audience!)