Earl Williams trombones and where to find them

[EriKon]

To me it looks like BAC really just used the bell flare and everything else is different with that little pictures that basically don't show anything. Or am I missing something?

[TromboneMonkey]

To me it looks like BAC really just used the bell flare and everything else is different with that little pictures that basically don't show anything. Or am I missing something?

You're probably correct in that the flare is the only remaining part from the original. The tuning slide and bell brace assembly don't look anything like the ones on my Donnelson 4.

In any case if it plays well it's a fair price.

[EriKon]

This week we have an all Williams tenor tb section at NDR Bigband

Drew, we need one of your Williams 10s for Ingo on btb

[guitrhythm]

As a relatively new member to Trombone Chat, this is my first post. I believe I’m probably a bit of an odd duck here as I primarily perform as a guitarist (…please don’t hold that against me) but have retained a love and appreciation for trombone as it was my first instrument and I still continue to play in community concert bands and the occasional jump swing gig locally.
I have appreciated everyone’s input, insight and knowledge on Trombone Chat and have a bit of a story around a Williams trombone that I just stumbled onto, since this thread is about where they can be found.
While at my local guitar shop (which also does very limited band instrument rental) I spotted an old coffin style case that simply said Williams trombone on it. The case was covered in layers of dust and just sitting on a shelf where it had been stored (I was later told) for about the last 7 years. I asked to see it, as I had recently been interested in finding a small bore horn (I usually play a medium bore Shires)
Turns out it is a Williams Model 6. It just is engraved with Made By Earl Williams in L.A. California, no fancy engraving beyond that. There is a patent number on the hand brace, a serial number in low 8xx, and it has the funny little wraparound water valve on the end crook. It appears to be yellow brass with a 7 5/8” bell. It’s in very good condition with only some minimal lacquer loss on the horn, mostly on the neck pipe. I played it there in the shop and while it was in some need of serious cleaning it sounded quite nice. I could tell it was a good horn but really didn’t know too much about it.
Talking to the manager, I inquired about his interest in a trade for a guitar I needed to move. He was most enthusiastic and ultimately agreed to trade straight across, as they get very little interest in horns and a ton of interest in guitars.
I got it home, gave it a good bath, did some serious cleaning rod work on the outer slide tubes. The inner slide tubes are beautiful with no noticeable plating wear at all. Just needed cleaning. Plays really clear and .
I’m figuring now, from what I’ve read in the the Williams threads I’ve since explored, it could be most likely from the 50’s. Does that sound about right? Does anyone have any further insight into what I might have here? Might be quite a gem. Maybe more horn than I bargained for.

[DaveAshley]

SCORE!

Sounds like an early 6, probably from the mid to late 50's. Average sale price is something like $3000-3500. It wouldn't be hard to sell, if that's what you want to do.

It's a special design that, in my opinion, demands a disciplined player. My Burbank-built Model 6 has loads of personality. Sometimes it makes fun of me.

[guitrhythm]

Thanks for your insight. Interesting that you say it takes a disciplined player. Wish I was better in that particular respect. My horn can make fun of me just about any time. Ha!
You mention it it's a special design and I wonder if you meant all Model 6 Williams or specifically ones from that particular era of them?

[Chazzer69]

Williams 8 on Facebook - Trombone Marketplace. Says it has a Meinlschmidt valve section and a Bach 42 slide. If anyone is interested. I can't seem to steal a link for it.

[EriKon]

https://www.facebook.com/share/p/ufV7YgBaMWhHXvUx/

[EriKon]

For the guys who play or have played a Williams model 8: What mouthpieces do/did you use?

I finally got at least a Burbank model 8 by Drew (still and even more looking for a model 9 now!) and I love the horn! But it seems to be very picky with mouthpieces. I tried basically all my small bore mouthpieces with various sizes and what works best by far is the Doug Elliott XT E4 setup. But it sticks out a tiny bit farther than I'm used to. Everything else didn't really work.

Any suggestions? And Doug, if you read this, would be the 4 shank the right choice for that bore size?

[ajtehoke]

i have a WILLIAMS trombone for sale. i font know how much they sell for, nor do i know anything about the instrument itself... can anyone help ??
[email protected]

[meine]

Do you have pics?

[Doug Elliott]

For the guys who play or have played a Williams model 8: What mouthpieces do/did you use?

I finally got at least a Burbank model 8 by Drew (still and even more looking for a model 9 now!) and I love the horn! But it seems to be very picky with mouthpieces. I tried basically all my small bore mouthpieces with various sizes and what works best by far is the Doug Elliott XT E4 setup. But it sticks out a tiny bit farther than I'm used to. Everything else didn't really work.

Any suggestions? And Doug, if you read this, would be the 4 shank the right choice for that bore size?

I have had the same experience, not being able to figure out what works on an 8. If I had one I could spend time on it... but I don't. Try a #2, the #4 doesn't seem to focus right.

I've had the same issue trying the K&H Bart van Lier horns, especially the weird .512 bore. Nothing seems to work well.

[timbone]

I probably put this in another post but back in the early 90's I used to visit Art Pearlman who was a clinician/artist for Earl. Art had a set of Williams and that included a double valve bass proto. I played his pigtail (Williams 9?) and to me it was the best trombone I had ever played. Art was a bass trombonist by trade ( Hollywood bowl) but when I met him he was playing lead for Louie Belleson. I'm sure he passed and am curious to where his horns ended up- perhaps Noah Gladstone knows. He had a lot of burt Herrick goodies too. Such a wonderful man and such a learning experience. I would visit him in his garage where he sat and played all day. He got in a bit of trouble in the Hollywood bowl referring to the violin section as fiddle players lol. I still have my Williams and Wallace which became my main horn.

[HawaiiTromboneGuy]

I probably put this in another post but back in the early 90's I used to visit Art Pearlman who was a clinician/artist for Earl. Art had a set of Williams and that included a double valve bass proto. I played his pigtail (Williams 9?) and to me it was the best trombone I had ever played. Art was a bass trombonist by trade ( Hollywood bowl) but when I met him he was playing lead for Louie Belleson. I'm sure he passed and am curious to where his horns ended up- perhaps Noah Gladstone knows. He had a lot of burt Herrick goodies too. Such a wonderful man and such a learning experience. I would visit him in his garage where he sat and played all day. He got in a bit of trouble in the Hollywood bowl referring to the violin section as fiddle players lol. I still have my Williams and Wallace which became my main horn.

Not sure about a 9, but I know his 7 (also with pigtail) was acquired by Harold M. and now resides in Sweden with Niclas R.

[EriKon]

For the guys who play or have played a Williams model 8: What mouthpieces do/did you use?

I finally got at least a Burbank model 8 by Drew (still and even more looking for a model 9 now!) and I love the horn! But it seems to be very picky with mouthpieces. I tried basically all my small bore mouthpieces with various sizes and what works best by far is the Doug Elliott XT E4 setup. But it sticks out a tiny bit farther than I'm used to. Everything else didn't really work.

Any suggestions? And Doug, if you read this, would be the 4 shank the right choice for that bore size?

I have had the same experience, not being able to figure out what works on an 8. If I had one I could spend time on it... but I don't. Try a #2, the #4 doesn't seem to focus right.

I've had the same issue trying the K&H Bart van Lier horns, especially the weird .512 bore. Nothing seems to work well.

Thanks Doug! I'll try a #2 shank when I get to it. I think I have one for the D+ cup, so not too far away from E cup. I will update once I got a chance to try.

[walldaja]

Schmitt's Trombone Shop just did a demo on a Williams 6

[EriKon]

There's a lovely looking Los Angeles Model 6 at Noahs shop BrassArk for a fair price imo. Not sure if it's still available because it says "sale pending" but who knows.