What Bach is this??

ttf_Le.Tromboniste · Post by **ttf_Le.Tromboniste** » Wed Jan 17, 2018 3:07 pm

Walked past the wind instrument shop on my way home and they constantly rotate the instruments on display in the window. Right now is a Bach trombone I hadn't seen before. Set up like a 42BO, but no upper bell brace, added brace in the F tuning slide. Counterweight (undersized) on the F side. Hard to tell with the reflections in the window and the general yellowish lighting but the slide looked like possibly nickel, except with oversleeves and diamond shaped slide stay ends, which the usual nickel LT slides lack. The crook at least (not visible on the picture) was definitely nickel or nickel silver.

Bach logo engraving, not Stradivarius

??

ttf_Full Pedal Trombonist · Wed Jan 17, 2018 3:29 pm

Never seen one like that before. If you stop in Id love to know what model markings are on the slide and bell and what the SN puts it at.

ttf_sirisobhakya · Post by **ttf_sirisobhakya** » Wed Jan 17, 2018 3:45 pm

It looks exactly like the ones I have test-played and mentioned in this thread http://tromboneforum.org/index.php/topic,103794.0.html

My band director said they (the ones I tested) are student model horns produced in Indonesia (if I remember correctly, if not, in another country in SEA). The price is so cheap ($600 new) and the quality... well... is less than the price.

What is the price of the horn you saw?

ttf_Le.Tromboniste · Post by **ttf_Le.Tromboniste** » Wed Jan 17, 2018 4:10 pm

Didn't see the price or detail, just saw it in the window display at night when the shop was closed. I usually bike in the smaller back streets and don't walk past that shop. But given that this is Switzerland, I would expect the price to be ridiculous.

None of the TB400B Ive ever seen had that brace configuration, and I seem to remember them having a rounded F crook not the very recognizable square crook.

ttf_sirisobhakya · Post by **ttf_sirisobhakya** » Wed Jan 17, 2018 4:15 pm

And the counterweight on F side is very peculiar as well...

ttf_Le.Tromboniste · Post by **ttf_Le.Tromboniste** » Wed Jan 17, 2018 4:23 pm

Quote from: sirisobhakya on Jan 17, 2018, 04:15PMAnd the counterweight on F side is very peculiar as well...

Exactly. But I tend to believe this one to be a real horn. My limited understanding of the culture here is that they like quality stuff and are prepared to pay quite a lot of money for it. It would surprise me that the store I trying to sell snakeoil...

New model perhaps? Step-up line with a mix of professional features and student/intermediate construction?

I'll see if I have time to stop by the store tomorrow or Friday and inquire about it.

ttf_sirisobhakya · Post by **ttf_sirisobhakya** » Wed Jan 17, 2018 4:28 pm

About the price, I would like to know if it is in the normal range of the price in the Schwyz, slightly lower (as isthe case of, say, TB400), or unbelievably low(er than normal horns). I suspect the last.

ttf_Alex · Post by **ttf_Alex** » Wed Jan 17, 2018 4:31 pm

Looks like a Bach TB 502B from what i can find on google.

ttf_sirisobhakya · Post by **ttf_sirisobhakya** » Wed Jan 17, 2018 4:51 pm

Quote from: Alex on Jan 17, 2018, 04:31PMLooks like a Bach TB 502B from what i can find on google.

That looks like it. But the thing that looks strange for me is: it is not listed on Selmer or Bach's website, nor is it listed on any catalogue I have seen in Japan so far (the TB200B is listed on both, and the TB400B is listed on catalogue as recently as October last year), so it should be either a very new model they haven't had time to list it yet, or very obsolete model they don't offer anymore. The latter seems less likely because as far as I have searched (5 pages of Google) there seems to be no review nor inquiry about it on any webboards (the TB400B has a few).

ttf_Alex McMahon · Post by **ttf_Alex McMahon** » Wed Jan 17, 2018 6:18 pm

I think it's a TB450. I have one, and it plays like a 42BO with LW nickel slide. Here's a promo video https://youtu.be/hNRlt1scFdQ (I had to watch with subtitles) that describes it as the link between the 501/502 level and the 42. I use mine primarily for the slide on a 36 bell. Excellent build quality, but maybe some mass produced parts to keep cost down.

ttf_Alex · Post by **ttf_Alex** » Thu Jan 18, 2018 2:36 am

Quote from: Alex McMahon on Jan 17, 2018, 06:18PMI think it's a TB450. I have one

The TB450 has an extra brace from the pictures I can find.
The TB502B looks exactly like the picture in the original post.

ttf_Bart · Post by **ttf_Bart** » Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:43 am

It is either a Bach TB502B or a Bach TB503B.

The 502B has a .525" bore and an 8" bell.
The 503B has a .547" bore and an 8,5" bell.

It is listed in our catalogue from GEWA (the distributor of Conn/Selmer for the Netherlands). Recommended retail price (for either) is 796 euros. I haven't had a chance to play it, so can't comment on the quality.

You can find more information here: https://int.gewamusic.com/product/17831/bach-bbf-tenor-trombone-tb503b.html

The TB450B has the extra brace and is listed (recommended retail price) for 1651 euros in our catalogue. It is mentioned that this model is "Made in Germany". No mention about the country of origin of the 502/503, so we can only guess.

ttf_Dukesboneman · Post by **ttf_Dukesboneman** » Thu Jan 18, 2018 5:31 am

I always thought a brace on the open wrap F slide was a good idea

ttf_Bach42T · Post by **ttf_Bach42T** » Thu Jan 18, 2018 5:55 pm

I would have to add another brace to the bell section just below the tuning slide brace, it just looks plain weird with that huge gap. There was some good savings right there leaving that off I'm sure.

ttf_Alex · Post by **ttf_Alex** » Fri Jan 19, 2018 9:01 am

Quote from: Bach42T on Jan 18, 2018, 05:55PMI would have to add another brace to the bell section just below the tuning slide brace, it just looks plain weird with that huge gap. There was some good savings right there leaving that off I'm sure.

That would make it a TB450 if it had the extra brace and cost twice as much.

ttf_MaestroHound · Post by **ttf_MaestroHound** » Fri Jan 19, 2018 9:16 am

Long forgotten, the great P.D.Q., the youngest son of J.S. perhaps??

ttf_MaestroHound · Post by **ttf_MaestroHound** » Fri Jan 19, 2018 9:16 am

Long forgotten, the great P.D.Q., the youngest son of J.S. perhaps??