Large bore (.547) horns in big bands

[JohnL]

The best sound I ever heard with .547 horns in a big band was the Woody Herman band when Jim Pugh joined. I was a high school student then, and Jim landed the lead chair just out of Eastman, and when the other 2 chairs opened up, they hired 2 of his classmates - the section was 2 88H's, and a 62H. I still have the old records from that time, and I was really inspired because that was the horn that I played. Jim sounded great - I heard them live at a jazz festival that my high school big band was at.

...and now I'm thinking of the possibilities of pairing a "big bore" trombone section with the Herd's four tenors and a bari sax section. Four Brothers plus Three Brothers, anyone?

[ssking2b]

I personally don't like big bore horns in big band sections except for the bass trombone. I'm not fond of .508 bore horns on lead either. There are some exceptions, of course.

I also think many young trombonists are pushed onto f attachment horns by band directors who don't know any better. College trombone teachers who play big bore horns often push their students into large bore horns.

I think you need to play both and know when the tool suits the job. Don't bring your .547 horn to the big band gig, and don't bring your small horn to the orchestral gig. On a combo gig anything goes.

[CalgaryTbone]

The Vanguard Jazz Orchestra for a while had two bass trombones, and for a very long time had a guy playing lead on a trigger horn...
In Mike Formanek's big band Jeff nelson doubled on contrabass trombone.
In the WDR band Mattias Cederberg doubles on Cimbasso.
I have doubled 3rd trombone with euphonium both in Darcy's band and John Hollenbeck's.
These are all pretty well known bands, well within the mainstream, at least in my mind!
so to make these types of pronouncements about how it has to be one way or another, i think, is not very accurate in reflecting current practice.
Not to mention that the bands we think of as classic, like Duke's and Basie's, also had a fair amount of instrumental variety, whether it was a valve trombone in a section, or three tenors with no bass, or 2 tenors and a trigger tenor, before the advent of 3 tenors and bass.

The lead player on a trigger horn was John Mosca - still playing (I just saw a video of him on YouTube with a small combo) and that horn was a 79H Conn. He played that same horn (I'm told) as a trombone major at Juilliard in the early 70's.

Jim Scott

[CalgaryTbone]

By the way, in response to JohnL's post, one chart I remember really liking from that Woody Herman section was Jim Pugh's arrangement of "Fanfare for the Common Man" with a rock feel. The opening was scored for the 3 Trombones and was similar to the Copland original - they sounded awesome!

Jim Scott