How good should student slides be?

[AtomicClock]

Yeah, a loaded question... sorry.

I get depressed every time I see a thread asking for a tech that does good slide work. It really underscores how hard they are to find. And how inadequate the local mom 'n pop store is. We have student trombonists spread throughout the country (world), but you have to live near a major city to keep a trombone operating properly.

Maybe my experience is exceptional, but as a pre-college student in a small state, I had a few experiences where the local tech took my (parent's) money, and gave me back a trombone that still had a slow slide. In college, I never bothered to seek out a tech because I had learned it was a waste of time and money. After graduation, I moved close enough to Boston that I could try Osmun, and it was a real eye-opener.

I suppose nowadays, one could send out the slide mail-order (to the Slide Dr. or probably other places), but it's a real shame that more can't be done locally.

Those of you that teach, how do your students maintain their slides? Do you inspect them? Do you tell them which tech to use?

[Cmiertschin]

I’m not exactly in a big city, but thankfully the tech I work with also works for the shop my college’s horns go to. Naturally I recommend that option. I also recommend they check out places like BAC, Heritage Music, etc if they have the chance - at least check their work out, play a few horns if you can.

We discuss slide maintenance in lessons, and teach that in our Brass Methods course for Music Ed students. They even learn how to disassemble and clean rotors!

[bassboneman69]

My students’ slides are usually pretty decent at the beginning of the school year.
Most by the middle part of the year are trashed due to neglect.

[Kbiggs]

I teach privately, and inspect my student’s slides periodically by using Reginald Fink’s test: disassemble the horn, hold the slide in your left hand as you normally would, and rest the outer slide on the floor. Pull the inner slide up quickly about 1 1/2 to 2 feet. If the outer slide stays put, it’s good enough for legato playing. (It might not be perfect, but it’s good enough.) If the outer slide jumps, then something’s not working right. Maybe there’s too little or too much lubrication, maybe there’s a dent, maybe it’s out of alignment.

I try to teach them about cleaning: encourage them to use a Brass Saver or a Yamaha swab, use a bath and snake for beginners, cleaning rod and cloth for more advanced students. It doesn’t mean they actually do those things, but you can always remind them… At some point, students need to take responsibility for cleaning and maintenance.

If you have a good tech, recommend them. If the local tech(s) don’t do good work, maybe try to gently approach them with examples of slides they worked on, ask them whether they could be improved…? It’s a difficult subject, asking someone to redo their work, but if the tech is a decent person it shouldn’t be too hard.

[2bobone]

I have always thought that "Student Level Horns" should be given to pros and "Pro" horns should be given to students ! If you really want to discourage a student from playing, give them a crappy slide that needs a hydraulic assist to get it from first to second position ! It WILL work ! A pro knows what to do to make most any recalcitrant instrument to do what it is supposed to do ! In the 1950's I interceded to get the abominable instruments that a school district was foisting off on eager students replaced so that these students stood a chance to acquire any degree of competence. A small investment in passing on the gift of music to those who as desperately need that gift as we did in our early years of musical infatuation ! I always encouraged parents to "invest" in their child's musical future, not only to give it a "kiss and a promise" ! Even if that student didn't proceed down the path you would always have a really good instrument to resell if interest by the student diminished. So far so good !

[Mamaposaune]

In my area of the northeast, most of the students rent from one of the national chains or one of several independents. The instruments I see as a private teacher are decent; new or slightly used Yamaha, King 606's or student Bachs. If a horn needs repair, they can return it to the store and are immediately handed another.
I check all my student's slides weekly, cleaning the younger one's and sometimes the older one's too, emphasing how important it is to keep it clean and in good repair.
Once the kids are old enough to take care of their horns and they are at the point that they are likely to continue, I suggest to the parents that they purchase one - either the rental (which is likely nearly paid for at that point) or putting the $ toward an upgrade.
The downside is the cost - renting for several years is expensive, but at least the kids are guaranteed a playable instrument.

[rudytbone]

I have always thought that "Student Level Horns" should be given to pros and "Pro" horns should be given to students ! If you really want to discourage a student from playing, give them a crappy slide that needs a hydraulic assist to get it from first to second position ! It WILL work ! A pro knows what to do to make most any recalcitrant instrument to do what it is supposed to do ! In the 1950's I interceded to get the abominable instruments that a school district was foisting off on eager students replaced so that these students stood a chance to acquire any degree of competence. A small investment in passing on the gift of music to those who as desperately need that gift as we did in our early years of musical infatuation ! I always encouraged parents to "invest" in their child's musical future, not only to give it a "kiss and a promise" ! Even if that student didn't proceed down the path you would always have a really good instrument to resell if interest by the student diminished. So far so good !

This! Everyone wants to use a good slide. One of the fastest ways to discourage a young player is to make them use a crappy slide. A student slide should be as good as possible.

[AtomicClock]

a crappy slide that needs a hydraulic assist to get it from first to second position

This is one of the reasons I used gobs of slide cream. It really helped make a stuttery slide more consistent at all lengths. And the real reason I touch the bell in third (and fourth) is to grab it for leverage. It's what I think of whenever I see a pro unconsciously reach toward the bell.

[Posaunus]

My teacher, starting in 7th grade (many decades ago, when the preferred slide lubricant was Pond's Cold Cream), would not put up with a sluggish slide. He taught me how to prepare, lube, and maintain my slide - and insisted that I keep on top of it. I was fortunate that my parents purchased for me an Olds A-20 Ambassador with F-attachment that came from the factory with an excellent slide; it stayed great until I sold it to a student a many years later.

[bentonar18]

I live in a smaller market area with only one repair shop. Now that I've played a few years (ok, a lot of years), I've met other players and talk with them regularly about where to send slides. Sent some to a shop in Houston (good), and then discovered the local shop was known to have one guy that was head and shoulders better than the others, so ask for him by name. Repairs seem to take less time now, too, since now "I know a guy". Long story short: ask the guys that know, and build a relationship if you can.