Learning to read as adult

[EZSlider]

Hey guys, wondering if anyone's got some good advice on learning to read as an adult? I'm 37, and play a number of wind instruments including trombones flutes harmonicas some accordion and guitar also. All this is by ear. Been playing music for a little over 12 years now. Although I in no way subscribe to the thought that just because I can't read music means I'm not a musician, as I think I've quite effectively proven to myself and all the people that I play with that I am.
However I would like to hone my skills more and open up the ability to play more things even things I've never heard by reading. Any help along the way would be greatly appreciated especially if you do have adult specific learning tips, especially for someone with not terribly much time available with three children and one on the way LOL.
EZ

[ghmerrill]

Well, by way of an odd sort of encouragement ... I know (and for years have played with) an excellent percussionist (from New Orleans) who once said to me "My entire family is musicians. I'm the only one who can read music."

I don't think you should overlook taking a few lessons to get you started if you can steal some time away from your kids/family. Even a couple or three lessons might be very valuable. Or maybe get someone you've played with to tutor you a bit. Otherwise, YouTube seems rich with possibilities -- but you'll have to sift through a bunch to find ones that work well for you.

[BrassSection]

Other than bass clef baritone which I was taught in my school days, I am self taught on trumpet, trombone, French horn, and tuba. Some learning was done on the fly in high school. I played bass clef baritone, guy beside me played treble clef baritone. One day I decided to look at his music and then mine. Within 3 days I was reading treble clef, useful for trumpet and French horn. My daughter is a highly trained French horn player, in her high school years I would often listen in at home practice and look over her material. My beginnings for advanced trumpet and French horn. My old lesson book for baritone was also for trombone, so I learned slide positions from that. Study, listen, get analyzed by daughter, that’s what got me playing playing better. I actually do use music maybe once a year. My weekly playing is basically improv with just a chord chart used by the guitar and keyboard players. I prefer improv, but with a session or 2 of having actual music I’m back in the groove.

[JohnL]

Maybe take some beginning piano classes? That'll get you going on both bass and treble clef. If you don't already play piano, that's a bonus - less need to forget what you've self-taught.

Learning to read music will also give you the basic tools needed to start writing music. It'll make it easier to share your musical ideas with others.

[tbdana]

Hey guys, wondering if anyone's got some good advice on learning to read as an adult? I'm 37, and play a number of wind instruments including trombones flutes harmonicas some accordion and guitar also. All this is by ear. Been playing music for a little over 12 years now. Although I in no way subscribe to the thought that just because I can't read music means I'm not a musician, as I think I've quite effectively proven to myself and all the people that I play with that I am.
However I would like to hone my skills more and open up the ability to play more things even things I've never heard by reading. Any help along the way would be greatly appreciated especially if you do have adult specific learning tips, especially for someone with not terribly much time available with three children and one on the way LOL.
EZ

I don't have any suggestions in particular, but I just want to say BRAVO! Wonderful you can play all those instruments, and wonderful that you want to learn to read music now. It will open up the universe for you. Go for it!

[BrassSection]

And the other thing I’d recommend is never stop learning. As a hint, in the 70s I was in my 20s. Now in the 20s I’m in my 70s. Played a song years ago in the key of D, but it didn’t seem to be a true D. Had a great sax player at the time, song really worked well with sax and my brass. Song got pulled back out awhile ago, it was now noted on the chord sheet is was in the Mixolydian mode. That got me scrambling to get more music learning. I didn’t feel too bad, tuba major in our group that plays bass and drums for us had heard the term, but couldn’t explain it to us. And alas the sax player we had moved away then passed away, leaving some empty spots in the song.

[AndrewMeronek]

I learned to read music from a pretty early age, so I'm not sure if my experience is all that helpful for an adult learning to read.

But: from what I've seen there is no shortcut, it takes a lot of practice. Pretty much like learning any language. Consider not only reps of playing on trombone (and whatever instrument) everything you can get your hands on, but also reading along with recordings. Just like with English or other written languages, at some point reading music becomes developing a large vocabulary of memorized "macro-patterns", much like written words pop put beyond the letters they're composed of. You can figure out all of these macro-patterns yourself, and you can also see the result of these patterns by observing recordings of others reading them. Circumstantially, both approaches may be better.

[muschem]

One of the things that helped me shake off the rust a bit reading tenor and alto clefs after a long break from playing was working on transcriptions in music editing software. I use musescore, which is freely available, but there are a lot of good options out there.

I find that transcribing goes faster if you type the notes using their letter names on a keyboard, as opposed to visually placing notes on the staff using a mouse. In addition to being faster, this approach provides practice reading the notes from the original source, translating those notes to letter names in your head, and then seeing the visual representation of how you read the music show up immediately on the digital staff in software when you press a key. It's also a fast feedback loop if you misread a note - you should be able to quickly see the discrepancy between the source material and your transcription and make a correction, both mentally and in the program.

[ghmerrill]

I did just -- totally by accident, not looking for anything like it -- just stumble across this. I have no idea if it's any good or of any use:

How to Read Music in 30 Days: Music Theory for Beginners

https://www.amazon.com/How-Read-Music-D ... C93&sr=1-3

[GGJazz]

Hi all.
Hi EZSlider.

Learn to read music is just like learn everything else : you have to start from the very beginnig , and move on , step by step .

So , of course you have first to learn the name of the tones placed in the staff . If you plan to read music with the trombone , you will choose the bass clef.
Then you have to learn the symbols that indicate the duration of the notes . Etc, etc.

Anyway , I believe that music is something that should be communicated LIVE from a person that knows it to another who doesn' t.
So , any well-educated musician can help you on this ; you could take just a couple of lessons at months , for a while , and when you will be more confortable , you could try to progress by yourself .

I do not trust the kind of book as " musicians in 24 hours" or so ....

Regards
Giancarlo

[ghmerrill]

If you plan to read music with the trombone , you will choose the bass clef.

Or the alto clef, or the treble clef -- depending on what your plans or inclinations are.

[GGJazz]

Hello again.

Of course ; do not forget tenor clef also....

Anyway , I think that for one that does not read music at all , would be easier and most useful to learn the bass clef , if he want play trombone in groups , etc .
Maybe also a lot more of books with songs , tunes , or exercises for trombone in that clef than on alto clef .

Just my opinion , of course.

Regards
Giancarlo

[EZSlider]

Wow guys thank you so much! Great ideas and advice.. I should probably add that I have a working knowledge of a handful of language and am mostly fluent in Morse code.. Yes Morse code.. I am a ham as well as a musician and associating sounds with meaning in not foreign to me.
The other direction though of symbols to sound and specifically pitch is pretty new.. I have made small investments over the years and am most familiar with treble clef from playing flute.
I can extrapolate information from a score but I can't hear it.. Rhythms are tough too.. I did come across a book called "musical notation for the intelligent beginner" at one point. I will dig up the printed copy again.
Just got done playing with some of my guys and a buddy of mine told me he could start teaching me! He is a pretty smart fella.. one of these euphonium players lol. He is a fine player as well as writer/arranger.. Should be able to get me off and running
EZ

[AtomicClock]

I think that given the EZ's background and goals, it makes the most sense to learn (nontransposing) treble clef. Sure, bass clef is the right answer if he wants to join a band or orchestra. But to communicate ideas to others, or to read and interpret found music, why not go with the overwhelmingly most popular clef? Every musical idea is in treble clef, unless there was a good reason to avoid it. It is the default for music education. And theory. And fake books.

[ryebrye]

I'm in a similar situation - but relearning how to read music. I did play piano as a kid, and had very basic music theory classes in elementary school - but it's been a while.

I'm primarily learning treble clef for the guitar (I already know how to play guitar from tablature, but not sheet music).

The biggest help has been a little phone game called "Staff Wars" just drilling in the notes on the staff (and above and below it) - just playing it for five minutes a day for a while helped get to the point where I can look at a note and know what it is without having to use any mnemonic devices. This is pretty critical to be able to see all the notes in a chord quickly.

Knowing the notes and being able to read them quickly was very important.

For rhythms, there are some other games I've found on the phone that aren't terrible but not good enough to recommend.

[EZSlider]

https://www.studocu.com/en-us/document/ ... c/41080496
For reference
EZ

[OneTon]

Essential Elements for Band Book 1, published by Hal Leonard, Is available for trombone or flute at Hal Leonard, Amazon, or perhaps your local brick and mortar music store. It will work just fine. Try to practice at least 30 minutes a day. If you should start to feel frustrated after 30 minutes and still feel like playing, go back to your ear for that day. It is a little like milking a goat. You can’t rush it. Then it clicks and you feel like you’ve been reading music all your life. Good Luck.

[BrassSection]

Not usually using sheet music, my biggest problem when having actual music is above the staff for trumpet high notes, and below the staff when I pull out the tuba. Oddly enough, can switch from bass to treble clef without having to think about it. Couple times thru outside the staff still comes back to me… hopefully will for many more years to come! I mostly get to choose my own octave (within reason) for my regular playing. Sometimes I’ll work up thru the octaves as a song builds. Like my pro trumpet buddy that occasionally joins me says, “If there’s no note written, you can’t play a wrong one, and if it doesn’t sound good you’re only a half step off!” Bottom line, practice in the ranges you’ll be playing in as you’re learning to read the music.

[ghmerrill]

Not usually using sheet music, my biggest problem when having actual music is above the staff for trumpet high notes, and below the staff when I pull out the tuba.

Reading ledger lines is a pain when it gets beyond 3. And if you don't do it regularly, the responses just seep out of your neuro-muscular system.

[EZSlider]

Picked up staff wars app. Pretty good for the money just pretty lame they don't actually play the tones. Anyone know if there's an app that does?
EZ

[AndrewMeronek]

I can extrapolate information from a score but I can't hear it.. Rhythms are tough too..

Based on other conversations on here, rhythms can actually be harder to read than pitch, at least once they start to get more complicated and you have to visually parse out rhythms in different kinds of meters.

[EZSlider]

I can extrapolate information from a score but I can't hear it.. Rhythms are tough too..

Based on other conversations on here, rhythms can actually be harder to read than pitch, at least once they start to get more complicated and you have to visually parse out rhythms in different kinds of meters.

I concur., have any good rhythm trainers out there?
EZ

[Tbonepts]

I’m a later in life returning player. My trombone professor always stresses rhythms as absolutely critical. Lots of you tube videos to help with this. Just my two cents.
Have fun!

[EZSlider]

I’m a later in life returning player. My trombone professor always stresses rhythms as absolutely critical. Lots of you tube videos to help with this. Just my two cents.
Have fun!

Thanks friend
EZ

[Sesquitone]

Based on other conversations on here, rhythms can actually be harder to read than pitch, at least once they start to get more complicated and you have to visually parse out rhythms in different kinds of meters.

For "unusual" meters, it sometimes helps to have a little mnemonic "saying" rather than trying to subconsciously count beats. When I was fortunate enough to be playing in the Cornell University Symphony Orchestra under the great composer/conductor Karel Husa, we were working on a piece of his in a very fast 5/8 meter: "2+3". Rehearsals were very ragged until Professor Husa suggested: think "Rimsky Korsakov, Rimsky Korsakov, . . . ." Suddenly, everything fell into place with a very tight ensemble. It occurred to me that if the meter had been divided into "3+2", the appropriate phrase would be "Igor Stravinsky, Igor Stravinsky, . . . ." Decades later, when I was playing in the Stow Symphony Orchestra under music director Darrel Music (yes, that's his real name and he's quite a jovial chap), we were working on an orchestral arrangement of some of Dave Brubeck's pieces from his "Time Out" albums. We were having trouble getting a tight ensemble on "Blue Rondo á la Turk". I suggested: "Darrel Music is a character, Darrel Music is a character, Darrel Music is a character; character, character, character". That worked perfectly. Another time, a piece we were working on was in a very fast 7/8 divided into repeating two-bar phrases: |3+2+2|2+2+3|. A bit tricky to keep track of by subconscious counting of beats: 1,2,3, 1,2, 1,2; 1,2, 1,2, 1,2,3.
Somehow, that first bar reminded me of an old Irish comic by the name of Paddy McGillycuddy. My suggestion was: "Paddy McGillycuddy was a funny character, etc., etc." Suddenly, everything tightened up nicely.