Sulek: pesky Cb

[harrisonreed]

Any of the collegiate/academia types hip to the errata in the Sulek Sonata?

I'm specifically wondering about the Cb accidental in the first measure of "A". That note has never sounded right to me in that line, and when it is echoed by the piano a few measures later, the piano plays a C natural. The official recordings of the piece have a Cb, but again ... Why is that strange note not repeated by the piano in the otherwise identical echoing line?

That aside, any actual known errata in the score that folks might be aware of?

Thanks!

[ithinknot]

I don't know if there's anything "officially extra" to know... but...

- it's consistent between solo and pno scores
- if the flat was a misreading/misprint of a cautionary natural cancelling the added flats that precede A, you might not expect the added natural in the 2nd measure of A

I agree that it's not entirely convincing, but it can be given a bit of help...

You're coming out of a lot of Cb - and b2/Phrygian is a recurring idea throughout - so you can choose to hear the initial statement of that theme as "bridging the gap" with the Cb, and then the piano "normalizes" the theme in the now-established diatonic environment when it takes over ... that sense of tiptoeing into the new material can be sold more or less, via rhetoric/dynamics/rubato/exactly how soon or strictly the Tempo I is established at A

(From a quick Spotify survey, Michael Buchanan takes that sort of approach, and Stefan Schulz really does though some of the rubato thereafter might be a bit too exciting... some other candidates don't, and generally the more that phrase stays in Heroic Principal mode, the more the Cb comes across as confidently wrong.)

[harrisonreed]

I'll take another look at using the tempo to sell it there. That is really a great idea.

[Crazy4Tbone86]

If you listen to a lot of the recordings, you will hear that many artists avoid the C-flat vs. C-natural controversy altogether. On many of those well-know recordings, the artists play that specific note very muffled so that the pitch is somewhat indiscernible!

In the early 2000s, I performed this twice within a few days. One performance was a traditional evening recital and we (the piano player and I) decided to change the C-flat to a C-natural so that it was consistent between the instruments.

The other performance was a lecture/performance for a couple of music theory classes. This piece was one of two or three pieces in which we demonstrated use of music theory in making performance choices. We presented a couple of phrases from the Sulek (the C-flat was the first one) that were inconsistent and the problems/choices the performers must make when preparing pieces. We let the audience vote on the solution for the problems. Of course, the college students chose to make that particular note a C-flat for both the trombone and piano because it made the melody more quirky which resulted in them giggling.

I’m away on vacation, so I don’t have the sheet music handy. I wish I could remember the other spot(s) in the music that were not consistent. I believe there was a spot where the melodic passage was diatonic major in one passage and was modal in another. However, the pitches were consistent between the trombone and piano.

Great piece. It is easy to see why it became so popular so rapidly!

[harrisonreed]

In the score, the trombone plays the Cb immediately, and when the piano repeats the line a few measures later, it is a C natural.

[Crazy4Tbone86]

Yes, my vote choice was to change the C-flat to C-natural at the beginning of the phrase. I think many artists avoid “committing” to the C-flat, so they play it as a “ghost note.”

[heldenbone]

Yes, my vote choice was to change the C-flat to C-natural at the beginning of the phrase. I think many artists avoid “committing” to the C-flat, so they play it as a “ghost note.”

That seems quite the opposite of what the composer would have intended. Two similar phrases, differing principally only in C vs Cb tells me "if it sounds wrong, play louder." Assuming it isn't a transcription error, Sulek would have done it to call attention to the difference / change.

[harrisonreed]

Based on the part ... It's obviously intentional. They even have the courtesy C natural in the next measure. I'm just wondering, I guess, why Sulek made that choice. The "transition" from one key or mode into the new one is probably right, but it's not convincing when you actually hear it.

[Kbiggs]

My two cents: It’s part of a pivot chord, a kind-of harmonic accent. It’s strange enough that it can be heard without any additional dynamic or articulation. Play it confidently as part of the line within the context of the harmonic transition to the next section, and without trying to either bring it out (accent) or cover it up (ghost it).

[Crazy4Tbone86]

Yes, my vote choice was to change the C-flat to C-natural at the beginning of the phrase. I think many artists avoid “committing” to the C-flat, so they play it as a “ghost note.”

That seems quite the opposite of what the composer would have intended. Two similar phrases, differing principally only in C vs Cb tells me "if it sounds wrong, play louder." Assuming it isn't a transcription error, Sulek would have done it to call attention to the difference / change.

Your last point is what I am thinking could have happened. What if the C-flat was an accident during some level of transcription and somehow we are still stuck with a wrong note? Stranger things have happened! The “courtesy C-natural” was probably never placed there by Sulek. It could have been placed there by an editor long after the music left Sulek’s hands.

Everyone seems to agree that the C-flat sounds sour (for me, I can say it just sounds wrong), so there are three choices: 1. Play the C-flat boldly and be ready for strange reactions from your audience. 2. Play the C-flat as a “ghost” or “soft mumbled” note to slip it through with little or no attention on it (this is what I have heard on a few recordings). 3. Change it to a C-natural and move on to more important things in life (this is what I choose to do).

[baBposaune]

Jeremy Wilson playing the Vox Gabrieli with the written C-flat first measure of letter "A." Sounds right to me.