Experimenting with 2b+ & 3b (slides/bells)

[JLivi]

So I've been an avid fan of King trombone and have found myself owning a 3b, 3bf and 2b+. I've played my 3b exclusively for the last 20 year and messed around with other horns along the way. I've recently acquired a 2b+ and am rethinking everything, but there are pros and cons to both setups.

One thing that I plan to experiment with is interchanging the bells and slides with each to see if there's a better combination. Some time in the next week or 2 I'll be messing around with that and see if I notice anything that gets me closer to what I need.

I love the focus of the 2b+, and my articulations are much cleaner, but there are moments where I have to switch from playing in a horn section (sometimes 2nd trumpet part) to playing a bass line, and the 2b+ just doesn't seem to work in that quick transition like the 3b does.

Have you messed around with an 8" bell at a .500 slide or 7.5" bell with a .508 slide? What were some differences you noticed. Even if it you thought nothing was different I'd love to hear about your experience.

[hyperbolica]

I just found today that a 3b bell will take a Getzen 3508 or 1050 slide (and thus a 6h, 48h, etc). Its a friction fit because the nuts are on opposite sides.

[Klimchak]

The 2b+ slide with the 3b bell is essentially a Benge 170, other than it having the annealed gold brass bell.

[modelerdc]

The Benge 170 was basically a king 3b bell (gold brass) with a 2B+ slide. These play very well, although I personally like the regular 3B, one of these might just be up your alley.

[MrHCinDE]

The 2b+ slide with the 3b bell is essentially a Benge 170, other than it having the annealed gold brass bell.

I have a Benge 170 and a King 3B/F which I also like to swap slides and bells around with. The weakest combo I found is the Benge slide on the King Bell, though I suppose a .500” horn with F valve might come in handy for something one day? Everything else I like for different reasons.

With the Benge slide, the Benge bell does play quite differently to the 3B/F with the same slide so I think the material and process do make a difference. I used to have a straight 3B also so can say the difference isn’t just due to the valve.

[Matt K]

Something that’s working for me really well is a Getzen 3508Y bell which is 7.75”. I love love love mine on my 607F with a 500/525. But I would be shocked if it didn’t work well on any of the king 2B+ and up.

[Jimbbob]

I’ve got a late model 2b+ (2007) that I really like. I typically play 2nd and 3rd in our local big band, so I’m always toying with the utility of a trigger for (primarily) 3rd part. Nothing below the staff but there are plenty of C’s and B’s and low f’s in the 3rd part. The 2b+ is very focused and bright so I had been on the lookout for a 8” bell that would work. I finally acquired an excellent 3bf earlier this year. As mentioned many times here, the 3bf can cover the gamut with just a change of mouthpiece. I’ve toyed with the 2b+ slide (which is perfect)and the 3bf bell. It’s crazy good, and gives a tone between the brightness of the 2b+ and the 3bf. It’s basically a pro version of the ysl356 (500/525 dual bore), which is a great horn also.

[harrisonreed]

Are there any other compatible slides for the 3B,? Especially if they have a locking nut that actually works

[JLivi]

The 2b+ slide with the 3b bell is essentially a Benge 170, other than it having the annealed gold brass bell.

The Benge 170 was basically a king 3b bell (gold brass) with a 2B+ slide. These play very well, although I personally like the regular 3B, one of these might just be up your alley.

This sounds great! This will be the first combo I try.

Are there any other compatible slides for the 3B,? Especially if they have a locking nut that actually works

From the King Slide Compatibility thread:
3B/2B+/606/Benge 170/Tempo with 8” nickel bell are compatible

But I'm not sure if you're asking about other brands slides that are compatible like the getzen 3508 slide that was referenced already. That I don't know

[harrisonreed]

As far as the Getzen being compatible, in my book it's not since the nut doesn't work.

I was just asking what slides I could use with a 3B bell, and lock the nut on it.

[Doug Elliott]

With a 3B, it's not just the bell size that's bigger. The entire bell section is much bigger and doesn't necessarily work well with a smaller bore slide. You're going to lose some focus if you pair a .500 bore slide with a 3B bell section.

[Sniffynose]

I use my Yamaha 891z slide.508 on my red brass 2115 2b+ bell and it’s great!
It’s like a regular 2b+ but better because it’s a more open blow.
Use my 3b slide also sometimes, but the yammy is lighter and tunes better.

[Matt K]

To clarify for me: mine is not a 3508 bell section, just the bell. My tech (crazy4tbone86!) shortened it a hair to adapt to the 607 valve and tuning slide.

I had a similar horn made a long time ago, a 2B+ upper and otherwise all 3BF. It played great, though I had a Shires at the same time that I thought played a little better, very slightly. Kicked myself for selling that for years. Tried other similar horns like the YSL356 for awhile.

Agree with Doug that if you want the extra focus, the smaller bell section on the 2B and 2B+ will provide it in a way that the 3B bell may not.

That said, if you’re open to more exotic suggestions, I find that the dual bore slides work really well so if you want something with just a bit more punch, a 500/508 slide might give you what you’re after. I’ve experimented with the 2B+ pipe as well as several Shires, Brassark 32H replicas, etc and have found that it does indeed give. A little more focus than the stock 2B+ pipe I started with.

There is precedent for the other configurations you’ve mentioned. Bach 16M is a 7.5” bell with 509 slide. For that matter, the 16 is that but with a 495/509 slide, similar to what I recommended above. Similarly, a lot of other horns are 500 with 8” bell.

Like I mentioned, I think 7.75” is the sweet spot for commercial for me. And the 500 upper gives a lot of focus that I would otherwise not get ona. 508 or 525 lower. And having the slightly larger bell section let’s the low range work well too.