Getzen

[Bach5G]

I noticed that a prominent trombonist has a Bach 42 for sale. Apparently he’s gone over to Getzen. The principal from the LSO, Peter Moore, was in town recently. He also was playing Getzen.

Getzen is on a bit of a roll these days.

[Posaunus]

Getzen is on a bit of a roll these days.

Not too surprising. Thanks to Christan Griego (at least partly, I think) and (apparently) good management, Getzen has been making fine instruments with consistent quality and excellent customer support.

We all should continue to support manufacturers, large or small, who care for their customers.

[Trav1s]

I'm very impressed with their products!

[norbie2018]

Manufactured in Elkhorn, WI.

[harrisonreed]

The Getzen I use for ceremonies is like a improved, high quality 88H. The unsoldered bell rocks.

I feel like, in terms of build, it's equal to my personal Edwards.

[greenbean]

Especially their large tenors and basses. Outstanding!

[ZacharyThornton]

I play a 4047 and prefer it to any tenor I have ever played. They are built in the same place as Edwards with the same care.

[Trav1s]

A local music store hosted a Trombone day and Getzen/Edwards had quite a few horns on display. After checking out the other brands, I found myself coming back to three horns at the Getzen/Edwards table. Each had its own character and appeal.

4147IB - this one just felt right and that's likely because of the Conn similarities. It was warm, flexible, and the entire range was effortless for me. And it comes with a nice case.
Horn revision in 2022: https://www.getzen.com/trombones/custom-reserve/4147ib/
Original release: https://www.getzen.com/2013/03/28/light ... ike-twice/

4047DS - This one is on closeout at the store that hosted the event. It reminded me of the T396-A but the sound did not have quite as much presence. I suspect more play time would help me figure it out. Case also included. The closeout price makes this horn very appealing... https://www.getzen.com/2011/12/15/intro ... m-reserve/

T396-AR - a close second for me but not as natural or comfortable as the 4147IB. My sound had a bit more sparkle/zing but required a different approach than the 4147IB. I'm sure I could learn it over time. No case. But so sexy.



If I had all the funds to buy new, I'd have a hard time choosing between any of them but if I had to pick, it's the 4147IB. YMMV

[Matt K]

If you like the Bousfield and you’re coming from Conns, the 4047ET is probably even closer to what you’d find ideal. It was unique among all the other Edwards and Getzen lineup when I tried it at ATW this year.

[arich621]

If you like the Bousfield and you’re coming from Conns, the 4047ET is probably even closer to what you’d find ideal. It was unique among all the other Edwards and Getzen lineup when I tried it at ATW this year.

Interesting, what makes you say that? Isn’t the 4047ET essentially the updated 4047DS, which was inspired by a Bach 42 feel as opposed to the Conn/Bousfield style?

[Trav1s]

If you like the Bousfield and you’re coming from Conns, the 4047ET is probably even closer to what you’d find ideal. It was unique among all the other Edwards and Getzen lineup when I tried it at ATW this year.

Interesting, what makes you say that? Isn’t the 4047ET essentially the updated 4047DS, which was inspired by a Bach 42 feel as opposed to the Conn/Bousfield style?

The dual radius slide crook and slide with really look Bach-like to me.

[arich621]

Is it a bass crook slide or just a wide crook that’s still .547?

[tbonesullivan]

I recall hearing a while back that they were planning on updating the 4047DS to be similar to the slide from the T-396AR Edwards horn. The change from the "vintage Mt Vernon" leadpipe to the Sterling Silver leadpipe is part of that I think, and they did other tweaks for Enzo Turriziani.

It still has the "Large diameter, yellow brass end crook" which is the hallmark of the Bach 42 style design.

[Matt K]

If you like the Bousfield and you’re coming from Conns, the 4047ET is probably even closer to what you’d find ideal. It was unique among all the other Edwards and Getzen lineup when I tried it at ATW this year.

Interesting, what makes you say that? Isn’t the 4047ET essentially the updated 4047DS, which was inspired by a Bach 42 feel as opposed to the Conn/Bousfield style?

This is where some of the language like "clone", "inspired", "copy" etc. diverge. I can see why one would say the 4047DS is a copy of a 42, even though I personally wouldn't. The key characteristic of the Bach sound to me is a one-piece w/ soldered bell bead and both of those horns have a two-piece, unsoldered bell bead. I've tried Conns and Conn like tenors with larger slides like 547/562 and just 562, both of those obviously with a wider, bass bore crook and the net result was still a feel and sound like the 88.

I didn't have my Shires to compare, but my Shires is an "inspired by" version of the 88 (2RVET7, rotor, 525/547 w/ a "narrow" crook), and judging by how it played, it felt the most similar to my 88 inspired Shires. Very efficient blow with lots of colors, but it was more "stable" across the dynamic range - as best as I could tell in that room. I imagine if I had a 2YVET7, it would respond similarly. But I think the 4047 lineup is sufficiently different from an 88 or 42 that I'm comfortable calling it something unique, in a good way. Much in the same way, I don't play a vintage 88, though I could have picked one up throughout the years had I wanted to. But coming from that "side of the fence", I thought it was great.

[hyperbolica]

I have been a bit afraid of (especially) old Getzens, but I recently got a 1050, and it's a screamer, quickly becoming a favorite. If I had the extra play money, I'd also have a 3508 or Edwards 302. Edwards isn't as popular as Shires these days, but they have remained a US owned business in a tough economy, and they definitely deserve kudos for making a range of great instruments under both names.

[tbonesullivan]

This is where some of the language like "clone", "inspired", "copy" etc. diverge. I can see why one would say the 4047DS is a copy of a 42, even though I personally wouldn't. The key characteristic of the Bach sound to me is a one-piece w/ soldered bell bead and both of those horns have a two-piece, unsoldered bell bead. I've tried Conns and Conn like tenors with larger slides like 547/562 and just 562, both of those obviously with a wider, bass bore crook and the net result was still a feel and sound like the 88.

It's not like they are the only company with "inspired by" lines either. Courtois has the Legend 420 (Bach 42 type) and Legend 440 (Conn 88H Type), but they do diverge on some key construction points.

Kanstul's "42 type" trombone was the 1570, and while it had the Bass Crook wide yellow brass slide, it was overall lighter in construction than a 42. It also has a dual radius tuning slide, which is definitely not "Bach-like". Their 88H type horn, the 1588, had the narrower slide with a rose brass slide, rose brass dual radius reversed tuning slide, but the bell is a single piece soldered type.

[arich621]

Interesting, what makes you say that? Isn’t the 4047ET essentially the updated 4047DS, which was inspired by a Bach 42 feel as opposed to the Conn/Bousfield style?

This is where some of the language like "clone", "inspired", "copy" etc. diverge. I can see why one would say the 4047DS is a copy of a 42, even though I personally wouldn't. The key characteristic of the Bach sound to me is a one-piece w/ soldered bell bead and both of those horns have a two-piece, unsoldered bell bead. I've tried Conns and Conn like tenors with larger slides like 547/562 and just 562, both of those obviously with a wider, bass bore crook and the net result was still a feel and sound like the 88.

I didn't have my Shires to compare, but my Shires is an "inspired by" version of the 88 (2RVET7, rotor, 525/547 w/ a "narrow" crook), and judging by how it played, it felt the most similar to my 88 inspired Shires. Very efficient blow with lots of colors, but it was more "stable" across the dynamic range - as best as I could tell in that room. I imagine if I had a 2YVET7, it would respond similarly. But I think the 4047 lineup is sufficiently different from an 88 or 42 that I'm comfortable calling it something unique, in a good way. Much in the same way, I don't play a vintage 88, though I could have picked one up throughout the years had I wanted to. But coming from that "side of the fence", I thought it was great.

Totally fair point, the 2-piece/unsoldered bell is definitely a divergent from being a true Bach “clone”. I was simply curious why you’d put it closer to the Conn 88 camp, since the bell taper is their Bach style mandrel and the slide is closer to a typical 42 slide. This horn has been getting some great praise and seeing people like Pete and Jon Whitaker switch over to that horn recently speaks to the high quality Getzen put into it.

[Matt K]

It's not like they are the only company with "inspired by" lines either. Courtois has the Legend 420 (Bach 42 type) and Legend 440 (Conn 88H Type), but they do diverge on some key construction points.

Kanstul's "42 type" trombone was the 1570, and while it had the Bass Crook wide yellow brass slide, it was overall lighter in construction than a 42. It also has a dual radius tuning slide, which is definitely not "Bach-like". Their 88H type horn, the 1588, had the narrower slide with a rose brass slide, rose brass dual radius reversed tuning slide, but the bell is a single piece soldered type.

I agree; my language of "if you like X, you might like Y" to (try to) avoid that implication. I will use the "inspired" by when it's marketed that way, such as the Shires 2RVET7, for example, which is as close to marketing that it's based on an 88 w/o actually saying Conn or 88:

based on the classic Elkhart models of the 1940s, ’50s and ’60s.

But the Kanstuls and Getzens diverge enough in my opinion, where I wouldn't call them "based on", and I don't think they're marketing it that way in most contexts. I probably would also use the "inspiration" for your examples and a few others... in particular Courtouis and Greenhoe, since they have models that essentially look the same as the 42 & 88, kind of share models numbers or hint at it. E.g. on Courtouis their version of the "42" is the "420". On paper, they seem to have the same construction as their inspiration, at least on the areas that I'd consider most important. With Shilke Greenhoes, it's GB (Bach) and GC (Conn); they look different, particularly on the wrap, but otherwise, they also have a lot in common on paper.

Totally fair point, the 2-piece/unsoldered bell is definitely a divergent from being a true Bach “clone”. I was simply curious why you’d put it closer to the Conn 88 camp, since the bell taper is their Bach style mandrel and the slide is closer to a typical 42 slide. This horn has been getting some great praise and seeing people like Pete and Jon Whitaker switch over to that horn recently speaks to the high quality Getzen put into it.

My wording implied that I thought the 4047ET was "like" a Conn 88, which I didn't mean to convey. Just that it's the closest to my 88-inspired horn in the Edwards/Getzen lineup. Coming from an 88, I suspect someone would like this horn more than others in their lineup. Although, that recommendation is more tepid than I intend; the 4047ET is a great horn, and if I hadn't gone on a very long search for my horn and were in the market it would certainly be towards the top of my list.

[tbonesullivan]

But the Kanstuls and Getzens diverge enough in my opinion, where I wouldn't call them "based on", and I don't think they're marketing it that way in most contexts. I probably would also use the "inspiration" for your examples and a few others... in particular Courtouis and Greenhoe, since they have models that essentially look the same as the 42 & 88, kind of share models numbers or hint at it. E.g. on Courtouis their version of the "42" is the "420". On paper, they seem to have the same construction as their inspiration, at least on the areas that I'd consider most important. With Shilke Greenhoes, it's GB (Bach) and GC (Conn); they look different, particularly on the wrap, but otherwise, they also have a lot in common on paper.

The official writeup on the Kanstul 1588 literally says "Based on a vintage favorite designed by the great Emory Remington, the Model 1588", and I can guess where the "88" in the model name came from. So that model, at least, they actually put it out there, though many parts of it were identical to the 1570.

With Courtois, the the 440 bell section, wrap, and even the grip are nearly identical to the Conn 88H. The 420 bell section. wrap, and grip look very much like the Bach 42B. Courtois even went as far to have a Two Piece bell on the 440, and a Single Piece bell on the 420.

Of course, I haven't tried any of the Courtois horns. I have tried Conn 88hs, and own both the Kanstul 1570 and 1588, and also have two Bach 42s. I think the Kanstul horns are definitely on the "Inspired by" side, and less on the "based on" side, but for the Courtois, they even copied the very square angles in the wrap for the 420. They definitely seem to be intended as "improved" versions of the Bach and Conn designs.

[Matt K]

Ah, didn't see 1588. I totally agree about the Courtouis and Greenhoe models though.

[jonphilpott]

Anyone know if they’re gonna remake “The Dude”?

[MTbassbone]

I would be curious to see if a Custom Reserve bass is developed.

[timbone]

I have to say hats off to a great family dynasty! They have navigated the test of time! I grew up in the 70’s taking lessons from a Getzen artist, and bought the student and Eterna horns. Years later at itf 2007 I believe, I found their .508 tenor most responsive. And after that, played the 1047 (?) at ETW and it was very good- in a high class regardless of valve. They just make good stuff! They’re pistons are great too.

[Posaunus]

Anyone know if they’re gonna remake “The Dude”?

Please don't ask!

[Posaunus]

Especially their large tenors and basses. Outstanding!

From my limited experience with one, I believe that the Getzen 3508 (0.500'/0.508" dual-bore) is a very fine small straight tenor trombone!

[greenbean]

Especially their large tenors and basses. Outstanding!

From my limited experience with one, I believe that the Getzen 3508 (0.500'/0.508" dual-bore) is a very fine small straight tenor trombone!

Agreed. I have played a 3508 and it was truly excellent.

There are a couple of the intermediate models that have underwhelmed me; but they probably play really well for the younger players these are designed for.

[OompaLoompia]

I briefly owned a 1050, 3508R, and 3508Y at the same time this year. I opted to keep the 3508R and sold off the 3508Y and 1050. They were all amazing horns, but at the end of the day, I only needed one of them.

The 3508R ended up winning over the others because it just sounded and felt better to play from my perspective. I love it, and it’s my primary horn along with my King 3BF. The 3508R sound and response is insanely good. There are pretty much no intonation quirks and the partials are easy to tune. It’s a beautifully constructed horn and the red brass bell is the gorgeous cherry on top. Even holding it is a delight!

A week ago, I briefly and impulsively put the 3508R up for sale because I wanted to fund a used Shires MD+ that was posted on here a while back for a pretty reasonable price. I was so enamored with my recent King 3BF purchase, so I went down the rabbit hole to read a post on here that claimed that the Shires MD+ plays like an ultimate 3B.

However, I immediately regretted putting the 3508R listing up and took it down shortly after posting it. I decided that trying out the Shires MD+ (a horn that I have never played) wasn’t worth giving up my primary horn that I already know fits me well and plays beautifully.

I’m heading to Minneapolis this summer so I’ll probably head over to Schmitt Trombone Shop to demo the Shires MD+. Until then, I’d love to hear opinions from people who have played both!

[OompaLoompia]

Additionally, I also purchased greenbean’s amazingly priced Getzen 1047F because I joined a community orchestra and needed a large bore horn. It’s also a wonderful horn and probably the best deal I’ve ever gotten on a trombone. Thanks greenbean!

[Matt K]

I’m actually putting a 3508Y bell on a King 607F I have now. Will report how that particular experiment works out once I get it back from the Shop.

The Shires MD+ is a great horn. Although the MG is what I’d go with if I were buying new from them. I had a Shires 508 + 1Y awhile ago that I sold a 3BF to fund. The Shires was just a little bit better for me. I did ultimately end up selling the Shires though, first for a YSL356, which I likewise sold to find the aforementioned 607F that I have a 500/525 slide on now.

I kick myself for selling that first King 3BF (which I had made a 500/508) and the Shires! But my stable can only be so big, and I really want that F attachment. Given other Getzen and Edwards I’ve played, and the various Kings over the years, I’m hoping this project is finally Goldilocks. Maybe even get a 3508R bell too. Mine will be modular, and I have a few other bells I’ll probably end up mounting like a Conn 18 Corprion… and a red pbone bell.

[Kevbach33]

Additionally, I also purchased greenbean’s amazingly priced Getzen 1047F because I joined a community orchestra and needed a large bore horn. It’s also a wonderful horn and probably the best deal I’ve ever gotten on a trombone. Thanks greenbean!

Never knock the Eterna line until you've tried them. That's how I got hooked to the 1052FD. Even at today's rates, they remain among the best values on the market. I won't sell mine until I somehow luck myself into a Conn style M&W.

There's nothing wrong playing wise with my Holton 168, but I'd probably own a 1047F(R) if they came with interchangeable leadpipes. There's something extra about fine tuning right after the mouthpiece. Then again, I was pretty smitten with an axial valve Shires I tried... Which means I could like the 3047AF if I gave it a whirl.

Not so sure I'd give up my 6H for the 1050 though... I'd need to try one back to back with the Conn.

I would be curious to see if a Custom Reserve bass is developed.

One has to wonder what would happen to the Eterna basses if such an instrument were to be released... And how would it compare/contrast with the Edwards B502 and B454CR-E?

[Matt K]

The Getzen 1052 I had was really good. If it had the same pillar the Enzo or Bousfield had... well... who knows. I bet a new Getzen would be really solid if they patterned it after their large bore lineup and had the harmonic pillar. Especially with basses where we often play the same bore size for commercial and classical. A nickel pillar for commercial and a copper pillar for classical or similar is enough after playing the large bore models to make a sufficient enough difference that I would have probably identified the same instrument as a different instrument if I were blind-folded.

[hyperbolica]

I briefly owned a 1050, 3508R, and 3508Y... Until then, I’d love to hear opinions from people who have played both!

I recently bought a 1050 and had a MD+ a few years ago. I was on a 508 safari. The MD+ was a great horn, but I honestly think I'd keep the 1050. The 1050 is light, balanced, comfortable to hold, cheap and cosmetically imperfect (so I never have to worry about messing it up ) The MD+ was a great horn, but it didn't seem to have the unfettered upper range that the 1050 has. They're kind of different animals. 1050 is lighter and more commercial, and the MD+ is heavier, more versatile, and could be used in a lot of different places. I think the MD+ overlapped my 79h a little too much, so I sold it. Here's a write up I did on my MD+: viewtopic.php?p=68560&hilit=md#p68560

I haven't had a 3508 yet, but I will eventually.

[Posaunus]

If the slide on the Getzen 3508 I played is typical (10/10), you won't find anything better. Congratulations, Getzen!

[OompaLoompia]

Thanks for the run down on the MD+, hyperbolica! I sold off my Getzen 1050 to a college student who is switching majors to study jazz. It’s such a great horn for a great price, but I wasn’t playing it because I’m always switching between my 3508R and King 3BF. The 1050 is in good hands. In some ways, specifically the slotting in the upper register, the 1050 was better than the 3508R imo. However, with respect to sound, response, lightness and feel the 3508R just couldn’t be beat. I will say the 1050 felt more laser focused than the 3508R if you’re into that sort of thing.

The 3508 slide is an actual 11/10 when freshly lubricated. Can’t believe I even considered selling it. Something something bird in the hand

[Matt K]

If you haven't played w/ the leadpipes, I bet a "1" might make the 3508R a little more focused.

[Cotboneman]

I've used the Getzen Eternas 1062FD and 1050 for over 24 years, and always felt that they were really well made horns and definitely players over the years. I've actually had both restored, because I couldn't bring myself to sell them. My 1062 is still a great big band or pops orchestra bass and I am using it this spring rather than my daily player, my Bach 50 AFG. The 1050 will be a legacy horn. I'll pass it down to my grandson when he's ready. He's showing a keen interest in trombone now.

[Neo Bri]

Every modern Getzen I've played was a very solid horn. I'm very interested in trying out the 4047s that people are talking about recently.