Bass Bone Maslanka 4?

[harrisonreed]

Anyone play the 4th part on this symphony? How serious is the composer about the FF low C's that crescendo through a fermata for 14-20 seconds at a time?

I'm pretty humbled by this part, and don't know how to approach these lines that seem impossibly long to play.

Also, the mute change in the middle of a phrase on a G whole note?

[Doug Elliott]

As Sam used to say, "Any idiot can write something you can't play"

How serious can a composer be if he/she knows nothing about the capabilities of the instruments they're writing for?

I'd bring a chain saw and play it with that.

[Burgerbob]

He does that a lot. Just breathe when you need to.

[WilliamLang]

for the mute change you can anchor the bell on the thumb of the right hand (with the slide on the fingers/palm depending on hand size) while putting a straight in with the left. helps if you keep the straight in your lap or under your left knee at first.

it's not comfortable on every horn and set-up for sure, and everyone has the right to not do it, but it is a physical possibility (i've had to find a lot of creative mute change hand positions over the years!)

[harrisonreed]

for the mute change you can anchor the bell on the thumb of the right hand (with the slide on the fingers/palm depending on hand size) while putting a straight in with the left. helps if you keep the straight in your lap or under your left knee at first.

it's not comfortable on every horn and set-up for sure, and everyone has the right to not do it, but it is a physical possibility (i've had to find a lot of creative mute change hand positions over the years!)

I'll try it. Sounds tricky though. Thanks!

[WilliamLang]

PXL_20221122_064715216.jpg

Definitely something to try at home first!

[calcbone]

Maslanka has written some good music for band, including a trombone concerto… but you can only do what is physically possible!

If anyone else is doubling that low C (even in a different section), maybe coordinate with them to stagger breathe. If not, then… just sneak a breath when you can!

Do any other instruments come in or change notes while you’re holding it? That might be a good time to hide a breath…

[bassboy]

When we performed this in undergrad, it was a larger wind ensemble and I was one of 2 basses covering this part. Having the other person there made a tremendous difference all over the place, and of course in the spots like the one you're describing, Harrison.
Best of luck with this, sorry I don't have better suggestions.

[Matt K]

Isn’t that the one where the organ is doubling like… all of the brass for all the loud stuff? I did that a few years ago and nobody as best I could tell wouldn’t have been able to notice with how overpowering the organ was

[harrisonreed]

Yeah, Matt you're absolutely right. I think we're still figuring out how to get an organ into a hall that has no organ. I think we will have some sort of organ so hopefully it's powerful enough to allow for that, although I'm going to be doing it either way.

The tubas double the C's a lot too.

[Matt K]

IIRC we had two piansts with electric pianos with one person playing the feet part and the other playing the hand part. They piped it into some gigantic speakers. I was a little confused by the whole spectacle but I had that sweet euphonium solo so I couldn't complain

[harrisonreed]

I think we are going to do the same, I have the Leeds Town Hall organ sound library on my PC and we will run that through the midi keyboards. The sound guy needs to get me a midi interface though.

Update: My bass playing is improving, but I don't think the bass part is playable as written. Lots of cheat breaths everywhere, and the last note is going to be a 20 second long low C, crescendoing from FF. Last note aside, I learned that I can play it if I use my L2 mouthpiece with a .308 throat, which is visibly larger in the throat than my current bass piece, but the sound is all wrong. The L2 is a tenor mouthpiece for playing top parts. It got me curious about trying a 2G sized piece with a larger throat, but I'm out of time and will have to make what I have work.

My issue seems to be that I can "muscle" the low stuff with air on the L2, but I need to finesse the low loud stuff on my actual bass piece, which usually works but the entire piece is low C's, FF. When there are 99 per page, some of them don't slot well enough to be loud.

Anyone know of a 2G design with a throat that is ~.308-.312"? Just curious about what is out there. Already saw the Griego-Hecht audition 1.5, his whole 1.5 series really, and that looks like it's worth trying.

[Matt K]

I'd probably use my DE Euph series piece for something where I needed to be that edgy but also hold out really long phrases. I'm on a Euph104N/K/K8. Obviously, a 2G rim size would be closer to the 106 though. I've also got a LI Brass piece around that size but my bass has been in the local repair shop for a while getting some leadpipe collars soldered, so I haven't had a chance to try it out. Actually... that reminds me I need to give them a call & if they can expedite that since it's been like 2 months If I wanted something to optimize specifically for that part I might get a K9 or K10 shank too. With Doug's cups, I feel like the jump from K to L is bigger than surrounding sizes and I'm a LOT more efficient on the K than my L unless I'm in really good shape.

[2bobone]

There are a fair number of books about orchestration that try to explain the limitations of various instruments to aid an aspiring composer as to the pitfalls of going "a bit too far". It seems that the ubiquitous electronic equipment used in today's music scene has totally bypassed the human necessity to breathe ! If those composers expect robotic expectations, let them write for robots ! I recall a Washington, D.C. composer, Robert Pariss, writing a passage for bass trombone that was, in the first place uninformed, and in the second place, humanly impossible. When I confronted him as to why he would write something so inappropriate, his reply was that if he didn't challenge the normal process of composition, who would ? In other words --- "You figure it out"! I won't bother to mention that there was a page turn involved in the matter [which CAN be easily solved].
In another instance, I played a piece in which a composer wrote a passage in which the bass trombone was expected to play a muted note in a running passage and then immediately go to an open horn one beat later. I tried to explain to the conductor, Christian Badea, that both hands of a trombonist are already engaged in operating the instrument and that it was impossible to insert a mute for one beat and then go back to an open horn. His answer ----- "It is possible ! He wrote it !"
That is the mentality with which you must negotiate as you try to make "music". In other words --- FAKE the performance just like the composer is FAKING the composition.
In another instance, a conductor, Milton Katims, a highly regarded violist turned conductor, once told the assembled orchestra, "This is a piece that won the award for new compositions with the The Seattle Symphony Orchestra, and at first hearing you will NOT like it. But after playing it a few times you will absolutely learn to LOATH it !"
Just because we think that someone calls themselves a musician is no reason to believe that they are. Just sayin' ------------------------------