Yamaha Slide Lube

[PosauneCat]

Do any of you use Yamaha Slide Lube? A couple of people have told me lately how great it is so I bought some. I thoroughly cleaned the inner and outer slide (twice) and applied as directed. I don't get it. It seems a little lame to me. I can hear a little slide noise (normal metal on metal stuff, nothing serious) than with Trombotine or Super Slick. Is there a trick to getting this to work that's not on the label?

I've always liked both Trombotine and Super Slick because in addition to being great lubricant it seems to almost cushion the slide (not sure if that is a good description, but you'll probably get it). Also there is zero slide noise with either one. My current Yamaha 882UGII slide is fantastic, better than any I have ever had, but the Yamaha stuff just doesn't seem to do it justice. Perhaps it's operator error.

[Matt K]

Did you get this:
https://smile.amazon.com/Yamaha-Trombon ... 072&sr=8-1

or this:
https://smile.amazon.com/Yamaha-YAC-102 ... 72&sr=8-12

?

The former is pretty good but I've always switched back to trombotine myself. The latter is, I think, geared more towards students where a longer application is more important than fastest action. Or something.

[Burgerbob]

I use the stuff from Matt's first link and have for probably ten years now. It gets the job done with no fuss on all my slides.

[ithinknot]

Assuming it's the cylindrical bottle stuff, a few things:

Make sure it's really well shaken, as it tends to separate. It should be coming out pretty thick. I pop the nozzle out and drop a small nut (or ball bearing, or whatever) in the bottle to help with mixing.

I find that it works best on its own only on really good slides.

On perfectly decent but not stellar slides (or good vintage slides that just have looser tolerances, even if no problems) that have just had a bath, I first get a light distribution of Superslick cream in the tubes, then wipe off the inner, swab the outer, then use the Yamasnot as normal, with swabbing and more Yamasnot to maintain indefinitely. No more cream needed until after the next bath. It's something to do with (ionic?) surface interactions - as seen thru water beading behavior or similar. I'm not leaving any significant quantity of cream in place, but there was some there once... like touching a brushed metal surface with a greasy fingerprint - you can wipe it so there's no surface grease left, but there's still the mark in the metal graining until you go at it with a solvent.

On cruddy slides, Yamasnot atop a normal (small) quantity of Superslick cream. I find this more forgiving than the Superslick tiny bottle silicone. Still no need for water spray, unless it's really really bad.

But some things might just be mysteriously fussy - or there's some cursed interaction with your body chemistry - in which case it's not worth arguing with a tube.

[PosauneCat]

Did you get this:
https://smile.amazon.com/Yamaha-Trombon ... 072&sr=8-1

or this:
https://smile.amazon.com/Yamaha-YAC-102 ... 72&sr=8-12

The first one.

[Matt K]

Does it get viscous when it heats up? I want to say it is less effective or something until you put it in the fridge again. I think I used to use it when I was in college and it was awful when I'd leave it in the sun so I just stopped using it outdoors. Or I could be full of crap.

I also used to use trombotine and then supplement with the Yamaha stuff but I got lazy and stopped goin that years ago.

[Posaunus]

Does it get viscous when it heats up? I want to say it is less effective or something until you put it in the fridge again. I think I used to use it when I was in college and it was awful when I'd leave it in the sun so I just stopped using it outdoors. Or I could be full of crap.

The liquid lubricants (Yamaha and Slide-O-Mix) are affected by temperature. They actually get less viscous as they warm up. If overheated (e.g., by being left in the sun or a hot automobile), they'll separate, thin out, and lose their lubricity. I think they sort of unhomogenize. It's very difficult to reconstitute these fluids after they're overheated. They will keep for a long time at room temperature, but to extend their life I pour a small amount into smaller plastic dispensing bottles, and put a small bottle into each trombone case. I keep the backup supply nice and cool in my refrigerator. Because I use very little on each application, and even though I wipe off the lube and clean my slides regularly (every few days), my Yamaha bottles last a long time.

[PosauneCat]

Assuming it's the cylindrical bottle stuff, a few things:

Make sure it's really well shaken, as it tends to separate. It should be coming out pretty thick. I pop the nozzle out and drop a small nut (or ball bearing, or whatever) in the bottle to help with mixing.

I find that it works best on its own only on really good slides.

On perfectly decent but not stellar slides (or good vintage slides that just have looser tolerances, even if no problems) that have just had a bath, I first get a light distribution of Superslick cream in the tubes, then wipe off the inner, swab the outer, then use the Yamasnot as normal, with swabbing and more Yamasnot to maintain indefinitely. No more cream needed until after the next bath. It's something to do with (ionic?) surface interactions - as seen thru water beading behavior or similar. I'm not leaving any significant quantity of cream in place, but there was some there once... like touching a brushed metal surface with a greasy fingerprint - you can wipe it so there's no surface grease left, but there's still the mark in the metal graining until you go at it with a solvent.

On cruddy slides, Yamasnot atop a normal (small) quantity of Superslick cream. I find this more forgiving than the Superslick tiny bottle silicone. Still no need for water spray, unless it's really really bad.

But some things might just be mysteriously fussy - or there's some cursed interaction with your body chemistry - in which case it's not worth arguing with a tube.

Wow, so you’ve used the Yamaha stuff with Superslick, huh? Interesting. My slide is fantastic so I wonder what it would be like using both on it? The Yamaha alone just doesn’t feel perfect like the other creams do. However, I was not shaking it up before applying. So it WAS operator error!

In high school I studied with a brilliant musician named Henry Schmidt, he is a musicologist and a fine trombonist - I still consider him my musical mentor! The only downside of studying with him was that I assumed all brass players would be wickedly smart! Oops. We both had an avid interest in photography so for a time we tried adding a few drops of Kodak Photoflo to our water bottles. Photoflo is a wetting agent that helps prevent water spots on film and negatives by reducing the surface tension of the water used in developing. It’s made largely of ethylene glycol. We loved how it made our slides feel (we both had Elkhart 88Hs). However, you had to clean your slide more often to avoid build-up. Also, and this is why I stopped using it, ethylene glycol is antifreeze! I figured it probably wasn’t great to be in such close proximity to a toxic substance!!! Live and learn…live is the most important part of that equation.

I’ll give the Yamaha stuff another try. I wish they had to label ingredients in these different lubes. I suspect the Yamaha stuff is silicone and a detergent, similar to Slide-O-Mix. I would guess that Superslick and Trombotine are either hydrolyzed natural or synthetic oils whipped into a delicious cream! But who knows?

[BGuttman]

As I understand it, both Trombotine and Superslick are roughly based on the published Pond's Cold Cream formula.

[mbtrombone]

I have been using the bottle Yamaha slide lubricant since it showed up. When my horn was brand new and just back from a great slide tune up it only took a drop on each slide and it would last a few days. 15 years later and I use a mix on Conn Formula 3 slide cream (not made anymore just had three containers from middle school) and the Yamaha slide lubricant. I try to wipe the inner and outer slides everyday and put some more of the conn on the stockings at the beginning of the day. I spray with water on first application, then add yamaha if I have a lot of playing that day when needed. The Yamaha is just super easy to use and is why I make all my students use it. one product is far more simple for an elementary or middle school aged student I find.

[PosauneCat]

I have been using the bottle Yamaha slide lubricant since it showed up. When my horn was brand new and just back from a great slide tune up it only took a drop on each slide and it would last a few days. 15 years later and I use a mix on Conn Formula 3 slide cream (not made anymore just had three containers from middle school) and the Yamaha slide lubricant. I try to wipe the inner and outer slides everyday and put some more of the conn on the stockings at the beginning of the day. I spray with water on first application, then add yamaha if I have a lot of playing that day when needed. The Yamaha is just super easy to use and is why I make all my students use it. one product is far more simple for an elementary or middle school aged student I find.

I’ll have to try the super slick and Yamaha combo. I like super slick but I find the silicone liquid you can use with it doesn’t feel as good as just the super slick. If the Yamaha is silicone with another kind of surfactant that sounds like a better combo with super slick.

I forgot it used to be called Formula 3! Thanks for the memory!

[PosauneCat]

The combo of Super Slick and Yamaha works like a charm. Best of all worlds! Thanks for the idea.

[Doug Elliott]

The Yamaha also continues to improve as you use it. It's better the 2nd and 3rd application than it was the 1st time.

[harrisonreed]

Don't forget that you have to, like, REALLY shake up that Yamaha stuff every time you use it. It can separate, especially when it's new. I heard about people putting into different bottles with stainless steel ball bearings to help mix it.

If you don't shake it up the first time you use it, all the best stuff gets used up almost right away because it had floated to the top. And all you'll be left with Is nice smelling detergent. You'll know this happened if the brand new bottle seems to work ridiculously well and it's kind of thick the first time you use it. It should be kind of thin and shouldn't have a trail sticking to the bottle when you stop applying it.

I've also noticed that it works best if you apply a small amount to each stocking, work it in, wipe it off the inners, and then spray with water. If it feels scratchy, THEN you add a small amount to each inner somewhere around 3rd position and work it in.

[PosauneCat]

The Yamaha also continues to improve as you use it. It's better the 2nd and 3rd application than it was the 1st time.

I tried it again today after shaking it and it is quite nice! I then tried doing what was suggested by a member above, using a small amount of Super Slick (wiped off the inner slide but a small layer left on the outer slide) along with the Yamaha Lube. It's AMAZING! I really dig my current slides, they're both great. The combo right now seems to be the best of all worlds. I'll keep experimenting to see how it goes and what I eventually settle on.

[PosauneCat]

Don't forget that you have to, like, REALLY shake up that Yamaha stuff every time you use it. It can separate, especially when it's new. I heard about people putting into different bottles with stainless steel ball bearings to help mix it.

If you don't shake it up the first time you use it, all the best stuff gets used up almost right away because it had floated to the top. And all you'll be left with Is nice smelling detergent. You'll know this happened if the brand new bottle seems to work ridiculously well and it's kind of thick the first time you use it. It should be kind of thin and shouldn't have a trail sticking to the bottle when you stop applying it.

I've also noticed that it works best if you apply a small amount to each stocking, work it in, wipe it off the inners, and then spray with water. If it feels scratchy, THEN you add a small amount to each inner somewhere around 3rd position and work it in.

Sometimes I think people don't read the full comment thread. I couple posts above I admitted to operator error by not shaking the bottle! After I did that today I must say it works very well!

[harrisonreed]

Don't forget that you have to, like, REALLY shake up that Yamaha stuff every time you use it. It can separate, especially when it's new. I heard about people putting into different bottles with stainless steel ball bearings to help mix it.

If you don't shake it up the first time you use it, all the best stuff gets used up almost right away because it had floated to the top. And all you'll be left with Is nice smelling detergent. You'll know this happened if the brand new bottle seems to work ridiculously well and it's kind of thick the first time you use it. It should be kind of thin and shouldn't have a trail sticking to the bottle when you stop applying it.

I've also noticed that it works best if you apply a small amount to each stocking, work it in, wipe it off the inners, and then spray with water. If it feels scratchy, THEN you add a small amount to each inner somewhere around 3rd position and work it in.

Sometimes I think people don't read the full comment thread. I couple posts above I admitted to operator error by not shaking the bottle! After I did that today I must say it works very well!

Ah, but I think you did not read the EMPHASIS on SHAKING the *********** $$$$$$$ *********** out of it before you use it. There is shaking, and there is SHAKING. And if you didn't do it first use ..... You used up all the music to begin with. It could be better

[PosauneCat]

Sometimes I think people don't read the full comment thread. I couple posts above I admitted to operator error by not shaking the bottle! After I did that today I must say it works very well!

Ah, but I think you did not read the EMPHASIS on SHAKING the *********** $$$$$$$ *********** out of it before you use it. There is shaking, and there is SHAKING. And if you didn't do it first use ..... You used up all the music to begin with. It could be better

Ah, I did read the suggestion to shake it, but apparently missed "shanking the ************$$$$$$$*********** out of it!" I did do that today to the point of utter exhaustion and it worked beautifully. However, I was so exhausted after the ********$$$$$$$$********* shaking that I could no longer practice.