joining the "olds" crowd

ttf_roywenk · Post by **ttf_roywenk** » Mon Apr 25, 2011 1:12 pm

Very nice site, John!

What a great history my old horn has!

/roywenk

ttf_sly fox · Post by **ttf_sly fox** » Mon Apr 25, 2011 1:20 pm

Quote from: JohnL on Apr 24, 2011, 09:20AM... First, my website is now up; www.itsabear.com. I've only got four horns so far, but more will be added soon. ...
John

thank you

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Sat Aug 13, 2011 9:28 pm

I just saw this thread, so I hope you all don't mind me jumping in late.

I have an LA Olds Standard Selfbalancing trombone that I bought last December from a local music store. According to the serial number websites that I found, it's date of manufacture was somewhere around 1932. There is a picture of it in my avatar.

The Olds is simply a joy to play!

ttf_JohnL · Post by **ttf_JohnL** » Sat Aug 13, 2011 9:46 pm

The avatar pic is kinda small, but it looks like it's in really good shape. Congratulations.

Quote from: OldsFan on Aug 13, 2011, 09:28PMStandard SelfbalancingIt's either a Standard (tuning-in-slide) or a Self-Balancing (conventional tuning slide in the bell); can't be both (though some sellers on eBay do tend to get confused about that).
Catalog scans here: http://www.rouses.net/trumpet/olds30_cmi/olds_cmi_1930.htm

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Sat Aug 13, 2011 9:55 pm

Quote from: JohnL on Aug 13, 2011, 09:46PMIt's either a Standard (tuning-in-slide) or a Self-Balancing (conventional tuning slide in the bell); can't be both (though some sellers on eBay do tend to get confused about that).

I'm sure you are correct, but the music store I purchased it from listed it that way. Mine has the tuning slide in the bell.

Here are some better pictures.

http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc1/mmpruitt2/Olds3.jpg
http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc1/mmpruitt2/Olds2.jpg
http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc1/mmpruitt2/Olds1.jpg
http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc1/mmpruitt2/Olds4.jpg
http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc1/mmpruitt2/Olds5.jpg

ttf_RogerC108 · Post by **ttf_RogerC108** » Tue Aug 23, 2011 7:53 pm

I guess I'm in this here "Olds Club" now too

. I just won an Ebay auction for an Ambassador and am pretty excited to get it in my grubby little hands. Not sure what year it is, but it is a Fullerton. Here are some pics from the auction

ttf_JimArcher · Post by **ttf_JimArcher** » Tue Aug 23, 2011 9:04 pm

Quote from: RogerC108 on Aug 23, 2011, 07:53PMI guess I'm in this here "Olds Club" now too

. I just won an Ebay auction for an Ambassador and am pretty excited to get it in my grubby little hands. Not sure what year it is, but it is a Fullerton. Here are some pics from the auction

If you give us the Serial No. we can relate the approx. year of manufacture.

And please, don't store the slide that way, reverse it end-to-end. I think you'll find that one of the braces, the first, will fit under the l. hand block; it'll keep the end of the slide from dinging up the bell. The water key should be up, not underneath.

ttf_RogerC108 · Post by **ttf_RogerC108** » Wed Aug 24, 2011 7:16 pm

Quote from: JimArcher on Aug 23, 2011, 09:04PMIf you give us the Serial No. we can relate the approx. year of manufacture.

And please, don't store the slide that way, reverse it end-to-end. I think you'll find that one of the braces, the first, will fit under the l. hand block; it'll keep the end of the slide from dinging up the bell. The water key should be up, not underneath.
I'll make sure and get you the serial number as soon as I receive the horn. I got notification today that it has shipped, and I should have it on Monday

ttf_Bob Riddle · Post by **ttf_Bob Riddle** » Sun Aug 28, 2011 8:17 am

Pulled out my Olds Super (13xxx)a bout 10 days ago due to my main axe being in the shop for repairs.I had forgotten what beautiful playing horns these are.Have used it on several gigs over that time and am more than pleased with how it responds and sounds.These are Very Nice playing instruments.I also own an Olds TIS from around 1915-1917 that plays very well(was my grandfathers horn).My goal is at some point to also own a Custom crafted p-15 and an Opera w/f.Sometime down the road,when $$ permit.For now enjoying all of the horns in my stable.
Bob

ttf_RogerC108 · Post by **ttf_RogerC108** » Mon Aug 29, 2011 5:09 pm

The Ambassador has arrived

. No dents, a little tarnish on the brass, but not bad. The slide moves pretty well. It could use a little work, but nothing to keep me from playing it. I'll post up some pics later.

The serial # is 329495. So what year do I have?

ttf_sly fox · Post by **ttf_sly fox** » Mon Aug 29, 2011 5:14 pm

http://www.musictrader.com/olds.html

ttf_RogerC108 · Post by **ttf_RogerC108** » Mon Aug 29, 2011 5:18 pm

Quote from: sly fox on Aug 29, 2011, 05:14PM http://www.musictrader.com/olds.html

Ah, thanks, Allen.

ttf_sly fox · Post by **ttf_sly fox** » Mon Aug 29, 2011 5:20 pm

earlier olds serial number lists are a little more complicated.

does your trombone say "Fullerton, CA" or "Los Angles CA" the later ones will say Fullerton.

now you face several questions:

do you only fix what needs to be fixed to make it playable or do you make it as "new and shiney" as possible.

I like to keep "vintage" marks myself.

he made that old thing sound like that?

what about this:

http://tromboneforum.org/index.php/topic,4198.0.html

another question:

http://tromboneforum.org/index.php/topic,44914.0.html

ttf_RogerC108 · Post by **ttf_RogerC108** » Mon Aug 29, 2011 5:26 pm

Quote from: sly fox on Aug 29, 2011, 05:20PMearlier olds serial number lists are a little more complicated.

does your trombone say "Fullerton, CA" or "Los Angles CA" the later ones will say Fullerton.

It says Fullerton. I knew that much before I bought it because he had it listed in the auction. It appears to have been made between September '59 and June '60. I'm giving it a bath right now. Would you recommend using Brasso or anything of that sort on the finish, or just leave the tarnish?

ttf_sly fox · Post by **ttf_sly fox** » Mon Aug 29, 2011 5:30 pm

me, if anything, i would just use a polishing cloth and hard work,

read my prior post

ttf_RogerC108 · Post by **ttf_RogerC108** » Mon Aug 29, 2011 5:42 pm

Quote from: sly fox on Aug 29, 2011, 05:20PM
earlier olds serial number lists are a little more complicated.

does your trombone say "Fullerton, CA" or "Los Angles CA" the later ones will say Fullerton.

now you face several questions:

do you only fix what needs to be fixed to make it playable or do you make it as "new and shiney" as possible.

I like to keep "vintage" marks myself.

he made that old thing sound like that?

what about this:

http://tromboneforum.org/index.php/topic,4198.0.html

another question:

http://tromboneforum.org/index.php/topic,44914.0.html

I think I'll leave it "vintage looking" and not worry about making it shiny again. And as for naming my trombones, I don't actually name any of my instruments (I have 6 guitars and now 2 trombones). As for being a trombonaholic?... I don't have a problem. I can quite any time I want

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Mon Aug 29, 2011 7:13 pm

Quote from: RogerC108 on Aug 29, 2011, 05:26PM Would you recommend using Brasso or anything of that sort on the finish, or just leave the tarnish?
Just wash it in luke warm water, then use Lemon Pledge furniture polish to add a little shine.

If the lacquer is totally shot, then maybe go raw brass.
From the looks of the pics, I'd just use Lemon Pledge.

T.

ttf_RogerC108 · Post by **ttf_RogerC108** » Mon Aug 29, 2011 7:38 pm

A quick pic from earlier this evening. Oh yeah, totally worth the $56 I paid.

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Thu Mar 22, 2012 8:13 am

I am new to this forum. Not sure where to post this, but I thought I would share the Olds I have. I am a retired hospital chaplain, played trombone in high school and college (Carson-Newman).

Olds Recording R20: I bought this at at pawn shop several years ago, paid $70 for it. They apologized for charging so much, but it had that thing (f attachment) on it. It plays well, has some lacquer wear given its age, a few dings. The case was pretty beat up.

Olds Super: My folks gave this to me new in 1958, when I was in High School. I played it through college. It was completely refurbished about 15-20 years ago, still looks in good condition. I found a Getzen Super Deluxe, bad slide, with a Bach mouthpiece and in a King Coffin case at the local mission store for $50, kept the case for the Super and mouth piece, sold the Getzen without case on Ebay for $40.

Early Olds, serial number 1649. I found it in an antique store recently. I got it as a wall hanger. It predates the "bear" trombones from Olds. It is all brass, no lacquer or silver plate. There is an inch long crack in one outer slide, which I have covered with scotch tape. The slide is out of line, the inner slide is spread out a bit, causing a tight fit when you pull it all the way in. The tuning slide is in the slide. I do not want to spend a lot on it, but I would like to get it a bit more playable, if possible. I took it to our local repair shop. They got the tuning slide freed up, but were afraid to do anything else, did not charge me. I am thinking about taking it back and see if they could at least re-solder the brace for a better fit.

Other Olds I have had include an Olds Ambassador (in grade school and until my folks gave me the Super), a nickel plated student horn which I later traded for a Bach 52 GB, and an Olds Superstar I found in a flea marker for $60, I loaned it to a talented daughter of a single mom with six children. She is making good use of it.

My non Olds trombone is a straight Bach 42 GB. I bought it about 20 years ago. It has become my principle horn. I always liked Olds, but have come to enjoy the Bach more. Now that I am retired, I am trying to play more often.

ttf_JimArcher · Post by **ttf_JimArcher** » Thu Mar 22, 2012 9:55 am

Chaplain, welcome to the Forum. PM sent.

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Thu Mar 22, 2012 10:01 am

Quote from: chaplainburton on Mar 22, 2012, 08:13AMCarson-Newman
If ya don't mind me asking, when were you at Carson Newman?
I was at Gardner Webb '83-'87.
Seen many a Gardner Webb vs Carson Newman games.

Welcome to the forum.
Hold onto those Olds. They don't make 'em like they used too.

T.

ttf_chaplainburton · Post by **ttf_chaplainburton** » Thu Mar 22, 2012 10:12 am

I was at CN 1960-64, graduated in'64. My wife also graduated in '64. Charles (Buddy) Freeman and Alice Cullinan, who both worked at Garner-Webb, were CN classmates. Buddy was also a class mate at Southeastern Seminary.

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Thu Mar 22, 2012 7:03 pm

Welcome, I'm a newcomer here too, and definitely more of a trombone newcomer than you. I am a former Army chaplain (medically separated) working as a civilian employee doing Substance Abuse education for soldiers now. I picked up a 1947 or so Olds Standard from Craigslist for $50 intending to sell it to buy a trumpet to play with my son, but once I figured out I was taking to the trombone more easily than the trumpet I decided to keep it.

I'm about two weeks in and I can play a mean "when the saints go marching in" and "At the Cross." LOL.

ttf_chaplainburton · Post by **ttf_chaplainburton** » Thu Mar 22, 2012 7:46 pm

Perhaps we should start a new thread for chaplains with Olds trombones!

ttf_cb56 · Post by **ttf_cb56** » Thu Mar 22, 2012 8:53 pm

I started on an Olds Ambassador when I was 8 years old. Saved up my money working odd jobs one Jr High summer and bought an Olds Super. Got a great deal cause Grandpa owned a music store. Sold the Super for cheap after I inherited my Dad's 3B . Now I wish I would have held on to it. A few months ago I bought an '58 Ambassador cheap on ebay and have been "fixing it up". It plays and sounds nice.

Now I want another Super to replace the one I sold. Maybe I need to get another summer job at age 56.

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 2:17 am

I'm a newbie on the forum. I started playing trombone in The 6Th or 7th grade. It was an Olds Ambassador. Later, the school let me use an Olds with F attachment. Started a band and played guitar, not trombone. Now I have started horn playing again. I first bought another Olds Ambassador made in Los Angeles the same year I was born, 1948. The mouthpiece was introduced to the bell many times over the years, but the slide is very smooth. I recently bought a Olds Super made in Fullerton with original case (a little worse for wear). The serial number on the slide (very hard to find there under the nut) is 563,738 which makes it a 1966 model( per "The Music Trader" site). This happens to be the year I graduated high school! Great slide and tone! It has a lot more lacquer left than the '48!

My question, what does it mean when the only number I can find stamped on the bell section is near the threads and it is only the number "21"? Also, is there a place to buy vintage hinges, handles, etc. for the case?
Thanks in advance,
dcnor

ttf_BGuttman · Post by **ttf_BGuttman** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 3:59 am

Hi and Welcome!

I played an Olds Ambassador with F when I was a kid. It actually was my main horn when I started playing again after my 20 year hiatus.

For the case hardware, look at the "build a case" threads in the Accessories area. There are a couple of sources for case hardware. If you have a molded plastic case I don't think you can buy many replacement parts, though. My Olds had the wood shaped case with the conventional hardware.

Good luck.

ttf_Doug Elliott · Post by **ttf_Doug Elliott** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 6:48 am

The distributors that sell instrument repair parts and tools to repairmen also have case parts. Ask a repair person to look up what you need and see if it's available.

Another source is www.ohiotravelbag.com/

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 7:03 am

Quote from: chaplainburton on Mar 22, 2012, 10:12AM My wife also graduated in '64. Charles (Buddy) Freeman and Alice Cullinan, who both worked at Garner-Webb, were CN classmates.
Can't for the life of me, put a face to Charles Freeman. What did he teach?

"Dr. C", was one of my favorites. Had her for many RE classes. She'd talk about South Western a lot.... I really wanted to go there after I got my BA, but never did. TX would have been cool.

Had many a fun time playing in the bands at Gardner Webb.
The O. Max Gardner Hall music building was open late at night for music majors to go practice (many private piano rooms).
It also came in handy for those of us who weren't music majors. It was a good place to take your gal and make out.

T.

ttf_dcnor · Post by **ttf_dcnor** » Tue Apr 24, 2012 1:47 am

Thanks for your replies, guys, but like I said, I'm a newbie and I am just hoping that this message gets to ya'll. I'll try the accessories section for case hardware as I also have the wooden, coffin with curtain style case as you do. Also, there is a real good tech at a local music shop here. i can ask for what I need there. Thanks.
p.s.

Anyone reading this have any info. on why this '66 Olds Super only has a "21" stamped on the bell section while having a full serial number on the slide? What would the '21' mean?

Dennis

ttf_JohnL · Post by **ttf_JohnL** » Tue Apr 24, 2012 10:58 pm

Quote from: dcnor on Apr 24, 2012, 01:47AMAnyone reading this have any info. on why this '66 Olds Super only has a "21" stamped on the bell section while having a full serial number on the slide? What would the '21' mean?The 21 is probably just some sort of internal part ID number. At one time, Olds put serial numbers on both the slide and bell, but they stopped doing that long before 1966. It appears that back when they did serialize both, they didn't really worry about keeping the matching parts together - there are lots of mismatched sets out there.

ttf_cb56 · Post by **ttf_cb56** » Mon Jul 02, 2012 4:56 am

Guess I should add the pics of my '73 Super Star to this thread.

ttf_cb56 · Post by **ttf_cb56** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 5:41 am

Can I ask an Olds question here?
My Olds Super star accepts a standard mouthpiece just fine, but my ambassador has a smaller reciever that doesn't allow the mouthpiece to go all the way in. I know that this is common because I used to own a Super.
My question is,Did Olds eventually switch over to the standard Mouthpiece receivers on all horns in the 70's ? Or was it just on some models? btw if I ever get the bux for another horn it will be a super. I really miss my old one (A fullerton '68).

ttf_BGuttman · Post by **ttf_BGuttman** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 6:08 am

I had an LA Ambassador with F (pre A/P/O numbers) that took a standard shank mouthpiece just fine.

My Olds TIS (c. 1925) takes a standard shank mouthpiece, but it may have had the receiver "bored out".

I know that at one time Olds used an undersized receiver but I have no idea when or where.

ttf_Doug Elliott · Post by **ttf_Doug Elliott** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 6:56 am

I think they were just inconsistent, as most manufacturers still are in that part of the horn.

ttf_cb56 · Post by **ttf_cb56** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 7:51 am

Really? I thought the narrower mouthpiece shank (Olds #3) and receiver were standard for them. I keep reading about people having to trim down their Standard mouthpiece shanks (like bach 12c) to fit an Olds horn. So it's the luck of the draw?

ttf_Doug Elliott · Post by **ttf_Doug Elliott** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 8:09 am

I wouls say most of the older horns had smaller receivers but I've seen some that were close to normal, especially in the later years. In all cases they were not totally consistent - as I said, even now you will find variance in the receivers of most manufacturers current production.

ttf_cb56 · Post by **ttf_cb56** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 9:02 am

Interesting. So this was not something done by design.(later Olds horns having bigger receivers)just luck of the draw.
Thanks for that info.

ttf_Doug Elliott · Post by **ttf_Doug Elliott** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 10:05 am

I wasn't there to know if it was by design. Only observing after the fact.

ttf_SMunger · Post by **ttf_SMunger** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 10:30 am

I have had numerous Olds trombones dating from the late 40s to the late 60s. On ALL of them, standard (Bach) mouthpieces do not go in as far (by about 1/2 inch) as they do on all other non-Olds trombones I have had. ALL Olds mouthpieces go in significantly further on non-Olds trombones than they do on the Olds instruments. This has been true of the small receiver models I have owned (Standard, Ambassador, Special, Studio, Recording) and the large receiver model (Opera) I owned. It has been my impression that it is widely acknowledged that the Olds receivers are smaller, although they do use the standard Morse taper.

ttf_cb56 · Post by **ttf_cb56** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 11:14 am

Looks like I'm back in the "Olds Crowd" again.
Just can't seem to stay away.
Here is my newly aquired 1959 Recording.
Man this thing sounds great! Easy blowing, great flexibility and tone.

ttf_stedcogs · Post by **ttf_stedcogs** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 12:52 pm

Quote from: cb56 on Jul 10, 2015, 11:14AMLooks like I'm back in the "Olds Crowd" again.
Just can't seem to stay away.
Here is my newly aquired 1959 Recording.
Man this thing sounds great! Easy blowing, great flexibility and tone.

Pretty horn!! I am fond of Olds. I am enjoying my recently created 1946 Super bell with a 1958 Ambassador slide ... I'm calling it an Ambassuper.

I had a Super Star in high school into college that was stolen from my car. I miss that horn.

ttf_cb56 · Post by **ttf_cb56** » Fri Jul 10, 2015 1:22 pm

In post #131 of this thread are some pics of the Superstar I had.
Sold it to a buddy who still plays it. Very under rated horns IMO. Yeah I miss that horn too.

Worked as a golf caddy one summer when I was 13 to earn enough money to buy an Olds Super.
That's another one I should have never gotten rid of.

ttf_cb56 · Post by **ttf_cb56** » Sun Jul 12, 2015 6:30 am

Played the Recording last night on a gig.
A banquet hall with about 300 people NO PA system except for the vocalist.
Man am I glad I had this horn. I love it!
Compared to my 2B which is like driving a sports car

the Recording is like driving a TANK!

(In a good way). A very nimble tank that goes everywhere you ask it to go without any problems. It's definitely the 800 pound gorilla in a room that everyone knows is there.

ttf_SBMaestro · Post by **ttf_SBMaestro** » Sun Jul 19, 2015 8:36 am

I just picked up what may be the "oldest Olds." I don't want to give away the exact serial number, but it is 1xx and is lower than the Serial No. 162 & 163 trombones on Robb Stewart's "Early Olds Trombones" website:

http://www.robbstewart.com/Olds/EarlyOldsTrombones.html

Mine is stamped "M" (for "Medium" slide bore--and it is NOT dual-bore), it is either silver or nickel-silver plated, and has a 7" bell with the TIS mechanism. Also, the same serial number is stamped on both the slide and bell sections, so it's a matching horn. It's in the shop now for slide alignment, but it's in remarkably good shape for its age and sounds great. (Sorry--I won't have any pictures until after I get it back from the repair shop)

I was curious if anyone out there has an Olds with a serial number lower than mine--or is this indeed the "oldest Olds?"

SBMaestro

ttf_JohnL · Post by **ttf_JohnL** » Sun Jul 19, 2015 9:12 am

Yours would be the oldest I've heard of, but there's no reason to think that an even earlier one isn't out there somewhere, waiting to be found. I had the oldest known Olds double for about a year, then an earlier horn surfaced.

A couple questions regarding the slide...

Does it have "one-piece" inner tubes or are the stockings soldered on? If the tubes are one-piece, is the bore of the inner constant, or does it expand at the stockings?

ttf_SBMaestro · Post by **ttf_SBMaestro** » Sun Jul 19, 2015 9:22 am

Thanks for the quick reply. I'm fairly certain the inner tubes/stockings are all one piece (and the entire thing is nickel-plated), and that the stockings do expand like a "modern" trombone's inner slide tubes. However, the horn is at the repair shop for the time being, and I'll have to get it back first to confirm it. I do have an old Courtois c. 1895 that has the stockings soldered on, so I know what you're talking about and what to look for.

SBMaestro

ttf_cb56 · Post by **ttf_cb56** » Sun Jul 19, 2015 11:15 am

Cool! Can't wait to see pics.
My not so antique '59 Recording (Fullerton) has now become my #1 over my HN White 2B believe it or not.
I just love the way it responds and it's BIG tone. Perfect for what I do gig wise.

ttf_JohnL · Post by **ttf_JohnL** » Sun Jul 19, 2015 12:53 pm

Quote from: SBMaestro on Jul 19, 2015, 09:22AMI'm fairly certain the inner tubes/stockings are all one piece (and the entire thing is nickel-plated), and that the stockings do expand like a "modern" trombone's inner slide tubes.Modern inners have a constant insider diameter through their entire length, including the stocking area (obviously, the outside diameter increases at the stocking - but there is no corresponding change on the inside). It's been reported that, on Olds' earliest version of the one-piece inner, both the outside diameter and the inside diameter are larger in the stocking area.

Frank Olds (and possibly Earl Williams, who is thought to have been Olds' first employee) were breaking new ground with the one-piece inner, and any information regrading its' development is of great interest to me.

ttf_cb56 · Post by **ttf_cb56** » Sat Jul 25, 2015 5:53 pm

Olds Recording before and after removing lacquer.
Played a gig with this horn last night and people were asking me if I bought a "New" horn.
Yes this is my 56 year old new horn, I just love it!

BEFORE

AFTER